Bedroom slide problem

AFChap · 04-13-2007, 07:16 PM

We had tornado and high wind warnings this afternoon, and as the storm hit we decided to bring in the slides. The bedroom slide (the bed on our rig) came about halfway in and stopped. Everything sounded normal, but the slide would not go out or in. It was beginning to rain heavily, so I put my feet against the wall and my back against the bed and pushed the slide back out. After some brief hail and a lot of rain, it occurred to me that I should not have been able to push the slide out without releasing the hydraulic pressure. I went outside and checked under the coach, expecting to find a big hydraulic leak, but found nothing. Looking at the bottom of the slide itself I saw a piece of plastic with foam attached around the mechanism rod just hanging on the rod. It belongs against the inside edge, tucked into the channel the rod is in. I tucked it back into place, then had the wife tap the extend button for two seconds, then the retract button. The mechanism worked as it should, and popped the plastic and foam back out. Looking into the hole, I can see a metal plate there with several breaks in it. When I removed the screws holding the bed deck down and hinged it up, I found two large diameter but very short screws lying beside the mechanism track. It appears they have come out of the mechanism, but there are no holes in what is exposed of the inner piece.

Has anyone experienced a problem like this with a bedroom slide? I'm thinking if I could get the inner screw holes back in line with the outer holes, I may be able to fix the problem by simply putting the screws back in. If not, I'll have to figure out how to get the slide back in the retracted position and get it to a repair place. The textbook answer of releasing hydraulic pressure at the T-valves and pushing it in doesn't apply here as I can operate the hydraulic mechanism fine! Actually, getting the slide in may be the easy part ...KEEPING it in while driving to a service location may be the bigger challenge!

AFChap · 04-13-2007, 07:16 PM

We had tornado and high wind warnings this afternoon, and as the storm hit we decided to bring in the slides. The bedroom slide (the bed on our rig) came about halfway in and stopped. Everything sounded normal, but the slide would not go out or in. It was beginning to rain heavily, so I put my feet against the wall and my back against the bed and pushed the slide back out. After some brief hail and a lot of rain, it occurred to me that I should not have been able to push the slide out without releasing the hydraulic pressure. I went outside and checked under the coach, expecting to find a big hydraulic leak, but found nothing. Looking at the bottom of the slide itself I saw a piece of plastic with foam attached around the mechanism rod just hanging on the rod. It belongs against the inside edge, tucked into the channel the rod is in. I tucked it back into place, then had the wife tap the extend button for two seconds, then the retract button. The mechanism worked as it should, and popped the plastic and foam back out. Looking into the hole, I can see a metal plate there with several breaks in it. When I removed the screws holding the bed deck down and hinged it up, I found two large diameter but very short screws lying beside the mechanism track. It appears they have come out of the mechanism, but there are no holes in what is exposed of the inner piece.

Has anyone experienced a problem like this with a bedroom slide? I'm thinking if I could get the inner screw holes back in line with the outer holes, I may be able to fix the problem by simply putting the screws back in. If not, I'll have to figure out how to get the slide back in the retracted position and get it to a repair place. The textbook answer of releasing hydraulic pressure at the T-valves and pushing it in doesn't apply here as I can operate the hydraulic mechanism fine! Actually, getting the slide in may be the easy part ...KEEPING it in while driving to a service location may be the bigger challenge!

NeilV · 04-14-2007, 03:26 AM

Paul,

Give Winnie and HWH a call and see what advice they can offer. The may have a simple proceedure that will allow you to get things easily lined back up or at least let you know that you need to push the slide in and block it with a couple of 2X4s one on each side and get it to a service center.

Hope they can give you a simple solution thet quickly gets you back on track.

Let us know how it works out.

Easyrider · 04-14-2007, 08:10 AM

To keep your slide in for travel to a service building wedge a piece of wood inside your bedroom at the top of your slide between the raised edge of your slide and the inside surface of your outside wall. Your slide won't go anywhere if you do this. Just remember to remove the wood before extending the slide back out.

AFChap · 04-14-2007, 07:39 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">To keep your slide in for travel to a service building wedge a piece of wood inside your bedroom at the top of your slide </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I have a "slide lock" bar that I'll use if I can get it in there ...not sure there is room.

Zimectrin · 04-15-2007, 08:11 PM

We had the exact same problem. Here is what may be happening.

The 'sled' that the slide travels on is attatched to a hydralic ram by two very short, coarse thread, countersunk, flat head bolts. They have come loose and then fallen out. It is good that you have them. IF they are undamaged (mine were) and the holes on the ram head are not reamed out (mine were), then you need to open the slide, lift the bed, and line the ram head to the sled so the holes are alingned by pushing the button to move the ram in and out. My bolts were allen wrench inset.

We obtained new bolts of a higher grade, slightly finer thread, and a little longer at a Loggers Supply store in Roseburg, WA.(the only place we could find anything close). We used locktight and reset the screws as best we could.

That was four years ago and hundres of opens/close and have not even thought about this until we read your post.

We did call HWH and were told to correctly fix the problem requires pulling the slide and recutting the ram head to accept a new bolt. Think HWH has since changed the connection of the sled to ram to avoid this unusual problem.

Anyone with a bedroom slide of 2001-2003 orgin, you may wish to check the tightness of the bolts described. Think of it a 'lug nuts' for the bed room...

Good luck and let us know of your progress.

Ptribbey · 04-16-2007, 04:30 PM

AFChap, I investigated my bedroom slide to see if I could identify what happened to yours. My underbed area is finished with a storage bin, and everything is covered. I think Winnebago made a mid model change in that I have seen earlier Ultimates that do not have a finished underbed area. My coach was built in May of 2003 so it is probably on of the last 03's built.

Back to the slide issue. I took my underbed area apart and the only thing that resembles what you describe is a black plate that has two bolts holding it in place on the top of the slide track. The plate appears to be what forms the hard stop for the slide travel. On my slide I can't even see the hyd. cyl. because it appears to be inside a square tubing assembly. I can't figure out how to get to the cylinder. Does this sound like the way your slide is? If not I wonder if they changed the slide design during the 03 model year.

Could you post a couple of pics? I am very interested in the resolution of your problem as we are also fulltime, and want to ward off any possible failures.

Zimectrin · 04-16-2007, 05:14 PM

Further note. The ram head is indeed inside a square tube. There are two access holes at the end and you have to line up the access hole, ram head and sled to reinsert the bolts.

I said that this is accomplished at the slide out position. That may or may not be the case in your situation.

AFChap · 04-16-2007, 07:20 PM

Steve

That is exactly what happened. Both screws came out. I played with it today and found the holes and found the threads in the sled are badly mangled. I put the screws back in and tightened them up, then tapped the extend button and one bolt popped clear out while the other was caught at an angle.

I talked with Winnebago & HWH. Both said the holes need to be tapped out and larger screws inserted, and recommend I go to a local dealer. I don't have much confidence in any of my dealer choices, and am thinking of seeing what I can do with it myself. The HWH tech I talked with said he had never heard of both coming out, but had seen one with one screw out. The said they are supposed to be installed with Loctite and speculated perhaps mine were not.

When you inserted larger screws with finer threads, did you tap the holes first?

Pat, my bed goes out on the slide. The bed platform is screwed down into the bed frame. What you describe sounds very much like mine. With your slide completely out, look at the inner end of the ram just short of the stop plate. There are two little "wings" on the square ram casing. At those wings, you should be able to see inside the outer case to the black inner case. What you are looking for are 3/4" head screws with a hex drive. They are countersunk, with threads only about 1/4" long.

Zimectrin · 04-17-2007, 06:32 AM

More information on our fix. We tried resetting the old screws and had the same experience you did.

We replaced the bolts with a hex head, grade 5 bolt. We were concerned that the hex head might not clear the aluminum tube throughout it's travel, but there was sufficent clearence. Do not remember the length, but they are longer than the 1/4" that was in there. Again you can have the bolt too long and it will not clear the mechanism's travel.

We did not tap the holes other than the harder bolt cutting it's own way in. We used the most permenent LockTight (is that the 'red'?) we could get. We did not use the slide AT ALL for a week to let it 'cure' as best it could.

HWH is a top notch company and this is an infrequent problem, but a coarse thread, 1/4" bolt is not as robust a fastener as should have been used.

Good luck with your fix and if we can help in any way, please inquire.

Ptribbey · 04-17-2007, 07:30 AM

Okay, I must be a dummy because I can't find the area you guys are talking about. Do you look for these access slots on the top, or side? I have looked all over and can't figure it out. I think part of the problem is that my underbed is finished and without a major job of tearing it out I can't see the underdeck area well enough. Any additional info would help.

Ptribbey · 04-17-2007, 08:32 AM

Guys, I found a sketch on HWH's web site that shows the cap screw location. This is one time I wish my underbed area wasn't finished. I will check mine out and let you know. It looks to me like if these screws were not locktighted during manufacturing it is a HWH screw up.

AFChap · 04-17-2007, 08:16 PM

I measured clearance between the inner piece with the bolt in it that moves and the outer piece it moves inside of ...there is a good 1/2" clearance on each side. If I can't find anything with a tapered head, surely I can find a bolt with head thickness less than 1/2". I'm going looking tomorrow. Ft Worth & Dallas should have something that will work!

Pat, I'd like to see that HWH link. I could not find anything like that. I'll see if I can insert a couple of pic's below -- never done that here! The left one is the full view of the slide ram housing under the bed. The screw laying as I found it is the dark spot beside the rail near the right end (inner end of the slide). The right pic is a close up of the screw holes lined up through the access hole.

Ptribbey · 04-18-2007, 06:40 AM

Found this sketch on the HWH web site, http://www.hwhcorp.com/ml19524.pdf.

Thanks for the pics, and again I will say this is one time I wish the underside of my bed wasn't finished. If my cap screws cams loose they would be trapped inside the square tubing as there is no way for them to get out as the decking is right up against the skid.

I am going to make another attempt to get to the screws to check them.

AFChap · 04-18-2007, 07:35 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Found this sketch </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
Pat

That's the right sketch! ...and the "Cap End Mounting Bolts" are the culprits. Between this list and the Winnebago Owners Group on Yahoo, I have found one 2002 Suncruiser, one 2002 Journey, one 2007 Sunrise that have experienced the problem in addition to my 2003 Ultimate.

I didn't get a chance to look for bolts today ...bought a new pair of western boots instead. Probably be Friday before I get another chance to look for bolts.

Ptribbey · 04-19-2007, 07:30 AM

Checked mine and the screws seem to be tight. It seems to me HWH needs to take the bow for this problem. Did the HWH tech take any responsibility for the problem? It seems like they should extend warranty coverage since it is something that should never have happened if the cap screws were locktighted as the HWH sketch describes when the unit was manufactured.

Are you going to try running a tap into the hole, or are you going to use a hard fine thread bolt?

AFChap · 04-19-2007, 07:42 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Ptribbey:
Did the HWH tech take any responsibility for the problem? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
HWH tech just said he had never seen both screws come out, but had seen one come out. I sent both Winnebago & HWH an email two days ago telling them I have found at least 3 other coaches that have had both screws come out. Got a reply from Winnebago, but none from HWH as yet.

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Are you going to try running a tap into the hole, or are you going to use a hard fine thread bolt? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
That will depend on what I find for new bolts. Plan to do some looking tomorrow. Hopefully can find a hard fine thread bolt maybe 1mm larger than the original and be able to force it in. The original screws came out with threard totally filled with metal, so there should be little in the way of threads in the holes for a same size bolt to bite into.

DragRacer · 04-25-2007, 09:13 AM

Mr. AFChap,

I was looking at the picture you posted of the ram from you rear slide. Could you tell me if you can see the hydraulic hoses that connect to the bottom of the ram? I have a hose to replace, but I have a sub-floor under my ram. I'm thinking I could trim the sub-floor to get to the hoses. Thanks for your time.

Bob

AFChap · 04-25-2007, 07:19 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Could you tell me if you can see the hydraulic hoses that connect to the bottom of the ram? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>
I think so ...in the picture on the left, dead center, there is a black loop under the ram guide (it has a couple of white spots on it). I believe that is a hydraulic hose, though it is a pretty small one. Actually, there are two there, you can see just one at that point. They go together down through the subfloor in the upper left-center of the picture. But I can see no fittings. They go up into the ram guide. The "white spots" you see are actually where the outer black casing is damaged from rubbing on the ram guide case.

I had a leak in my slide hydraulics about a year ago. I had a dealer repair it while doing other work. They found a bad fitting, and HWH provided it free of charge.

TheRVGuy · 04-25-2007, 07:57 PM

DragRacer,

For the hose your are refering to it is necessary to pull the cylinder to access the hose. The job is accomplished by extending the slide and removing the cylinder from the outside underneath the slide.

HWH has a written procedure to accomplish the task. While it is not too difficult, it is a job you want to approach with patience. Also, the re-install requires a bit of an undocumented "trick" that is associated with the placement of the hose.

If you choose to do this yourself, I'd be glad to walk you through the process.

Mike