Help! Power Control System freaking out! can only run 1 AC in Texas heat!

mjeffrey · 09-02-2013, 12:45 PM

Help!

Our Power Control System (PCS) is reading 40+ AMPs on Line1 even thought nothing on L1 is actual on. Line 2 is working fine. So if we try and run an Air Conditioner on L1 (and 2 of our 3 AC are on L1) all the loads on L1 get shed to attempt to remain below 50 AMPs. So no L1 washer, water heater, etc. either.

Our (outside) Progressive Surge protector says that the amps on L1 are 0A so there doesn't appear to be a real power drain and no circuit breakers are tripping.

We have turned off everything, and the breaker at the RV park panel, to try and reset everything (PCS monitor panel is blank) but when we turn things back on we still show 40+ amps on L1.

Running with the generator give the same results.

Is there another way to reset the PCS monitor and system?

Where is/are the sensors that reads current? Help!

grtharris · 09-02-2013, 12:55 PM

Check voltages sounds like you are missing one of the legs at the panel and the PCS thinks you are on a 30amp service.

mjeffrey · 09-02-2013, 02:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by grtharris

Check voltages sounds like you are missing one of the legs at the panel and the PCS thinks you are on a 30amp service.

All voltages check out. 50 Amp mode indicated on monitor panel.

After carefully poking the "Current Sensor/Barrier Wall Assembly" the L1 current reading is back down to 1 to 2 amp (with nothing on), but when the first/last "shed" AC unit fires up the instantaneous amp reading goes to 70 amps and is quickly re-shed.

I hesitate to try and loosen and re-tighten anything at this point as it is already 87 degrees and rising in the coach. (Hating the brown/beige color scheme even more right now). Will limp by with one AC for the rest of the day and not unplug to diagnose because that would turn off the AC and/or I could make things worse.

mjeffrey · 09-02-2013, 02:29 PM

We read in the manual that there might be some kind of "limp home" mode. Sounds like it would maybe stop the auto-management of load shedding and just let us manually make sure we aren't overloading the system. Anyone know how to turn that mode on?

Keith K · 09-02-2013, 03:32 PM

There have been a lot of threads that discuss the powerline management system. Some things to try, although they seem off the wall, is to unplug the line (looks like a phone cord) into your inverter, reset the breaker for the inverter, and if you have one, reset the breaker for the water heater. Strange, I know, but when I reset the inverter plug mine returned to normal. There's also a fuse behind the panel, you can check that and remove/replace to see if that helps.

movin-on · 09-02-2013, 04:01 PM

The current sensors for the ems in our coach are in the main ac service panel...Take the cover off to see if anything looks suspect...Kill the power for a bit and make sure everything is tight especially the neutrals (white wires)....

RKL · 09-02-2013, 06:43 PM

Try the progressive device on another power supply. My similar problem was a bad progressive unit. Disconnect it and see if things return to normal on the power panel. Rkl

grtharris · 09-02-2013, 07:13 PM

Looking at your wiring diagram, try turning off the breakers going to the A/C's that are not coming on. Could have a bad A/C unit loading the system down.

vsheetz · 09-02-2013, 07:32 PM

Just to be sure it's not the park power pedestal, can you plug into another that is known to be ok?

dengraham · 09-02-2013, 08:29 PM

Jeffrey,
I think Grant has the right approach. Turn off the circuit breakers for both L1. Then turn one on and try it. Turn it off and then turn on the second one. It's worth a try to see if you can, at least, get two running.
RKL raises an interesting point. Sure seems strange it would be a bad progressive devise but it may also be the problem. Eliminate it first.

John Hilley · 09-02-2013, 09:27 PM

Friend had a Progressive Industries EMS go bad on their way to Colorado. Sent it in for warranty repair and had it sent to Colorado, worked for 10 minutes and then quit. Haven't heard if they have gotten it working yet.

mjeffrey · 09-02-2013, 10:26 PM

Thank you for all the ideas and thoughts.

We went to a friend's house to avoid the heat of the RV for the rest of the day and now, 9:30 PM, are back and the 1 AC has caught up to the day time heat and we should be able to sleep tonight.

While we were out I went to the Precision Circuits, Inc. web page [ Home ] and did some research. I thought I might call and see if they had weekend/holiday support and George answered!

We discussed my situation and he offered a two ideas to defeat the load shedding, and now that we are back to the RV I gave them a try.

Unfortunately the first suggestion didn't prevent the system from load shedding and the second suggestion of pulling the power form the back of the PCS control board, defaulted to no AC power at all.

We see the same results on generator, but we did try removing the Progressive surge protector. No change.

We can't reach another power pedestal from where we are, but again the generator showed the same results.

I just called George/Precision Circuits, just before 10 PM on Labor Day and again he answered! Gave him an update and we came to the conclusion that our current sensor must have been damaged. Probably due to some surge.

We are going to take the coach in tomorrow to see if we can get a replacement part ordered, but it is going to be another/few long hot days before this is behind us.

Thanks again and we will keep you posted.

wa8yxm · 09-03-2013, 06:48 AM

Your EMS should not be shedding loads to stay below 50 amps (And 2 A/C's are well below 50 amps) it should only shed to keep below 30, really 27,amps and then only if on 30 amp service.. Oh, 2 A/C.. Just cleaned Carrier Air V 13,500 BTU jbs.. 27 amps. EXACTLY.

John Hilley · 09-03-2013, 09:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjeffrey

We read in the manual that there might be some kind of "limp home" mode. Sounds like it would maybe stop the auto-management of load shedding and just let us manually make sure we aren't overloading the system. Anyone know how to turn that mode on?

Their WEB site isn't too intuitive, but here is the page where you can download the tables

Goodyear Tire Inflation Loading

mjeffrey · 09-03-2013, 03:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Hilley

Their WEB site isn't too intuitive, but here is the page where you can download the tables

Goodyear Tire Inflation Loading

Goodyear?

mjeffrey · 09-03-2013, 03:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wa8yxm

Your EMS should not be shedding loads to stay below 50 amps (And 2 A/C's are well below 50 amps) it should only shed to keep below 30, really 27,amps and then only if on 30 amp service.. Oh, 2 A/C.. Just cleaned Carrier Air V 13,500 BTU jbs.. 27 amps. EXACTLY.

Yes we should not be shedding, but if the AMP sensor says you are over 50 whether you are or not, it will shed loads.

When we showed it to the tech at our local Winnebago/Itasca dealer L1 said 70 AMPs! when it should be 0. Sensor is toast... So nothing shed able on L1 is available right now. L1 = front A/C, rear A/C, washer, engine heater?

The midship A/C is all we are running and it is 92 degrees inside.

The plan is to get parts (entire AC panel and PCS controller) ASAP and disconnect the entire mess of wires for L1 , L2 and inverted sub-panel bus and re-wire. Not feeling good about all those wires getting back to the correct screw down.

John Hilley · 09-03-2013, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjeffrey

Goodyear?

It some how got cross linked with another post

DancinCampers · 09-04-2013, 12:05 PM

I think you should be able to remove the ac low voltage control wire from your ems pc board relay, wire nut together and then it should run.

jerichorick · 09-05-2013, 06:24 PM

Jeffery, you seem to be having some real troubles. I asked how your AC was keeping up on 'the roof' thread. This thread was a surprise to me.

I agree with your reasoning. Your generator is giving the same indication. I have not opened up my service panel to look see what's there. Shut the pedestal breaker off and shut the inverter down. Verify the panel is dead and tighten everything in sight. If these connections all seem good then look for physical damage. Next go to the transfer switch and open it up. Make certain it is all dead. Tighten all of the connections and look for heat damage.

I don't know how familiar you are with electrical panels, that is why I am recommending a full power down condition. If you know what you are doing you know this is over kill I am recommending. In any case use care.

Rick

dengraham · 09-05-2013, 08:25 PM

Dan,
Help me understand what you are recommending? Are you saying to by-pass the ems board? And, then everything should run? I am not sure where the board is even located but I like your idea. If you have a precision circuit ems system, I don't know how it can be by-passed but would love to know how to do it. Thanks for any help.