Generator help ASAP

Upslady · 05-03-2013, 05:25 PM

Itasca horizon 2005 was pulled in to shore power. Electric went out do to downed lines. We unplugged and trying to run generator for heat in MH! It runs a little then shuts down we have full tank of diesel. Any ideas what to check? Never did this before!

Steve Ownby · 05-03-2013, 05:35 PM

Do you have auto gen start? If so, do you have auto start and auto stop programmed into the inverter remote? If so it may be shutting down due to the house batteries being at a high state of charge. If you have a gen problem you will get a blank code on the start/stop switch.

Try turning off all heavy loads and after it runs for a period of time, add loads one at a time.

FIRE UP · 05-03-2013, 05:46 PM

Ladyups53,
Ok, let's see here. How long have you owned your present coach? In other words, has this generator ever done this before? Ours is the '04 Itasca Horizon with the 330 CAT and, the 7.5Quiet Diesel Gen. Here's something you can check, right off the bat. You go outside and open up the hood to your generator access. There you will see the panel with a few things on it and, another start/stop switch for your generator.

What I'd like you to do is, start the generator using that switch. Then, if and when it cuts out prematurely, look directly at that switch. On that switch is a red/light, right on the toggle part of the switch. If there's an operation problem that the "ECM" or, Electronic control module for the generator can pick up, it will display a "code" on that little red light. It will do this by "blinking" in a certain phase or, frequency of flashes of that light.

It will be something like, "Blink-Blink-Blink" then a pause, then it will do it again. If it does that, that's a primary code. Then you push the stop side of the switch and start the generator again. If it should stop again, count the blink rate and pauses again. If it does it again and, the frequency is: Blink-blink-blink pause, blink-blink-blink.. a long pause and starts the frequency over again, that's code for " Code 33". In most of the 7.5 QD gens, a code 33 represents an "over heat" condition.

And, we (who have been there) know it's a false code. But, it what it really means is, you've got a problem with the temp sensor in the thermostat housing. Let me, and anyone else watching this thread know what you find. We'll get back to you on the answer.
Scott

Skip426 · 05-03-2013, 05:47 PM

Don't know if this will be any help at all, I had a similar problem , and traced it to low fuel supply , caused by a kinked line behind the gen set.
Gen set out on slide it ran fine , with the set in the line kinked and the fuel couldn't get to the set fast enough, died in 2>3 mins would not re-start for 5mins.

bluepill · 05-03-2013, 05:48 PM

Is it an Onan Quiet Diesel? If so, which model?

Upslady · 05-03-2013, 06:13 PM

Well we got our other generator out of shed and have it running. Plugged MH into it and all seems to be working. Pulling 23 amp out of 30 showing on panel. We are running elect heat to save propane for cooking. MH is heating up nicely! Hope to be nice snug as a bug in a little bit! Still need to figure out problem with on board gen!

Upslady · 05-03-2013, 06:52 PM

Scott yes that's what it's doing. Yes we have the same gen.

FIRE UP · 05-04-2013, 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ladyups53

Scott yes that's what it's doing. Yes we have the same gen.

Ok, just so we're on the same page here. Are you saying that you've looked at the switch, and watched the little red light and, it's blinking in the sequence(s) that I described?
Scott

Tony Lee · 05-04-2013, 08:12 AM

One fault involves a faulty coolant temperature sensor not sensing a rise in coolant temperature in the first 5 minutes after starting after which it shuts the generator down. If you then restart it, it will run forever.
Too hard to get at my sensor - need to drop the whole unit - so I just put up with it.

FIRE UP · 05-04-2013, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tony Lee

One fault involves a faulty coolant temperature sensor not sensing a rise in coolant temperature in the first 5 minutes after starting after which it shuts the generator down. If you then restart it, it will run forever.
Too hard to get at my sensor - need to drop the whole unit - so I just put up with it.

Well Sir,
You must have something totally different in the programming of your gen ECM than I do. When mine displayed the code 33, I tried every combination known to man for trying to get it keep running. It stopped each and every time, displaying the code, each and every time. I displayed the pictures of my tear down and, and it was no wonder it had a hard time running with a sensor in the condition mine was in when I removed it. Some are worse than others.
Scott

Upslady · 05-04-2013, 02:47 PM

Scott, yes its giving the very same code you gave. Blink blink blink-blink blink blink pause then starts over. We tried starting it several times and each time it ran about a min. Then shut down.
Any ideas wher to start?
Thanks
Bren

FIRE UP · 05-04-2013, 05:26 PM

UPSlady,
Well, this is a hard one to answer. The reason, it all depends on your capabilities. First off, since you have an '05 Horizon, and, by me "squinting" at your avatar picture, it appears that your generator has a slide out tray that it sits on, correct? If so, you're half way through the battle. Much of what I'm about to tell you solely depends on your capabilities and desire to do repairs etc. yourself. Some don't want to mess with stuff and have paid technicians do the repair. That's entirely up to you. I don't blame you if you went that route.

Now, if you choose to dive into this repair, it, in all reality, is not very hard. It's time consuming to say the least but, for the most part, it's just a bunch of nuts and bolts. There have been a number of us on here that have experienced the same symptoms/codes etc. and, it, for the most part, has always been the same remedy, A NEW TEMP SENSOR!!! The temp sensor, looks just like a spark plug, almost the exact same shape. It is located in the lower, what I call, thermostat housing. Onan calls it "water pump flange". I have no idea why because it's not part of the water pump.

Anyway, what happens is this. Those sensors have a small, about 1/2" in diameter, barrel on the tip of them. That tip resides in a machined hole, only a tad bigger than the barrel itself. While the rest of the little Kubota diesel engine, the radiator, and all the water jackets, hoses and more get a good flow rate of coolant around, in and through all these parts/components, the cavity surrounding the little temp sensor is so limited in coolant flow that, even with quality condition coolant in your system, that little barrel starts to corrode. It will eventually corrode to the point that it is solid between the barrel and the machined hole that it resides in.

When it does that, it begins to send false readings to the ECM and, the results appear in many ways and facets. On mine, it became hard to start, no delay in cold weather and it would crank and crank and crank and crank 'till it' finally started and then, it would blow out a ton of white smoke. Then, the infamous code 33 appeared after it did exactly what yours did/does. It would start, run for a bit, then shut itself down. It would to this repeatedly.

So, I took it upon myself to dive into seeing what's up with the little beast.

It's a long story but, I'll give you the very short version

1. Remove all the sheet metal (panels) surrounding the gen. (easy to do)
2. Locate the temp sensor, front of engine, just below the upper thermostat housing, facing towards the passenger side with a white wire attached to it.
3. Remove the white wire.
4. Here comes the possible part. Sometimes the sensor comes out without any form of problems.
5. Sometimes, like mine, if fought me, due to corrosion, all the way to the end. I used heavy duty wrenches, vice grips, pipe wrenches and more 'till I finally heated the surrounding area with a propane torch and, at the same time, sprayed the left over guts of the sensor, with some 'Freeze". There was enough contraction in the remaining brass portion to "crack" the hold on the lower thermostat housing and, I got it out.

Then, again, if yours comes out easily, all that's needed is to replace it with a new one and you're good to go. Then, replace all the sheet metal around the gen and replace the lost coolant and, fire it up.

Now, here's one more avenue for you to think about. Look up a user name of:
John and Angela on this forum. If you can, contact them via PM etc. and ask of his remedy. He had/has the same problem but, they are traveling and don't want to take on such a drastic job while out on the road. His temporary remedy is ingenious, to say the least. But, it's only temp. So, you've got some thing to think about here. Let us know what you plan on and, if I can be of any help, in any way, let me know. Been there done that, in depth.
Scott

Upslady · 05-05-2013, 07:55 AM

Scott, thanks for all this info. Hubby is retired mechanic so he should be able to do this. I'll report back on how it goes. May be awhile as we are in the middle of packing to move. Downsizing! LOL
Thanks again

cbeierl · 05-05-2013, 10:08 AM

Just fyi, here's Scott's earlier thread 7.5 Quiet Diesel Gen, just finished issue(s) corrections with some useful pictures and discussion.

RCtime · 05-08-2013, 06:34 PM

Ladyups53

I have just experienced the same TEMP. SENSOR failure.

See my post OH my, When it rains it pours.

I have just posted the results of my estimate of repairs from an authorized Colman Generator repair facility.

Good luck to you and your husband. If he can do the repairs himself he will save a lot. Apparently the big iffy problem is if the temperature sender removes easily or not.

Upslady · 06-09-2013, 12:00 PM

Fireup
Ok we finally got time to work on this. Yes it was a buger to get out and when it come out half the little spring broke and came out! So now how did you get all that corrosion out? Hubby is working on it right now trying to free the rest of that spring and clean it out. Thought you might have an easy way if there is such a thing! Any other tips you might be able to give would be appreciated.

FIRE UP · 06-09-2013, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Upslady

Fireup
Ok we finally got time to work on this. Yes it was a buger to get out and when it come out half the little spring broke and came out! So now how did you get all that corrosion out? Hubby is working on it right now trying to free the rest of that spring and clean it out. Thought you might have an easy way if there is such a thing! Any other tips you might be able to give would be appreciated.

Brenda,
As stated in a PM, I'd be really anxious to see a pic of the situation. If the spring you're talking about is the one "inside" the sensor, then, it's possible that you might have already dropped a portion of that sensor down into the cooling system. But, without seeing it, and as close up as you can, it's hard to tell just what you've got left facing you, in terms of pieces and parts of that sensor. But, take your time, (as if you have any choice) and, use whatever means you have to get all of that sensor and remaining pieces out of there without the possibility of dropping them into the cooling system.

Now, if you've gotten it all out, you'll possibly need a tap, to clean out the threads. I forgot what threads it is. Once that's done, then, all that's needed is a new sensor. About $16-$17.00 at your local Cummins/Onan dealer. Let us know how it's going. And, try and get a picture if possible.
Scott

Upslady · 06-11-2013, 09:11 AM

Fire Up just wanted to let you know we got the gen going! New sensor and a new thermostat. We are up and running. Sorry I didn't get a picture but yes it was the spring inside the sensor. Hubby got it all out and cleaned out and all is good!

Thanks again for all your help.
Brenda

FIRE UP · 06-11-2013, 11:36 AM

Brenda,
Roger that. Glad all is well and working. Nothing like a good running coach and all its additional components operating as planned. Wouldn't it be great if it stayed that way forever?

Scott

Upslady · 06-12-2013, 10:58 AM

Well I wish I could say everything else is working like it should. We still have to get the rt slide to come in. We also discovered the cover won't come out over the steps. Oh and we need to have a new cooling unit for the fridge!

Hey other that that we are good to go! LOL Going to order Amish unit for the fridge and try to get the slide in so we can get coach to the city for repairs. Love living in our very small rural area but sucks when you need repairs.
Thanks again for all your help,