Xantrex Auto Gen Start

smlranger · 05-09-2007, 08:17 AM

OK, John Canfield and you other gizmo gurus..will the new Xantrex AGS module work with the older rigs like mine? Can all or most of the wiring be done at the One Place panel? I have the Freedom Combi 20 inverter and I don't believe it has CAT5 connectivity. However, can the install be done without hooking directly to the inverter?

Tried calling Xantrex but after 30" on hold, gave up.

smlranger · 05-09-2007, 08:17 AM

OK, John Canfield and you other gizmo gurus..will the new Xantrex AGS module work with the older rigs like mine? Can all or most of the wiring be done at the One Place panel? I have the Freedom Combi 20 inverter and I don't believe it has CAT5 connectivity. However, can the install be done without hooking directly to the inverter?

Tried calling Xantrex but after 30" on hold, gave up.

vicsryd · 05-09-2007, 01:33 PM

Can you qualify which AGS module you are talking about? The RS series is what John has. The only other one I know of is the Fredom/Prosine compatible unit.

John_Canfield · 05-09-2007, 03:20 PM

Gary - I Don't have any idea if the AGS will work without a compatible inverter networked. You need the control panel to program the AGS but the issue is if the control panel will work directly connected to the AGS. My guess is no but I think you are going to need to talk to a Xantrex tech to find out for sure (maybe download the manual?)

Harry B · 05-09-2007, 04:16 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">OK, John Canfield and you other gizmo gurus..will the new Xantrex AGS module work with the older rigs like mine? Can all or most of the wiring be done at the One Place panel? I have the Freedom Combi 20 inverter and I don't believe it has CAT5 connectivity. However, can the install be done without hooking directly to the inverter? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

I am not familiar with Xantrex AGS, however the ONAN EC20 & 30 AGS units can be retrofitted to coaches not currently equiped with AGS.

They work with most generators Onan has provided. The degree of difficulty depends on how accessable the needed wiring is.

Incase of the One Place Panel, most but not all wires are there to connect the Onan AGS'. I installed the EC30, which is more involved to install than the EC20 but offers more functionality.

Pusherman · 05-09-2007, 04:44 PM

Gary,

I just today ordered the Onan Energy Command EC-30 from Cummins Onan Indiana. I just saw the install Garybtt just did in his Horizon, and am going to try the install myself. He was able to make all the connections at the One Place panel, with possibly 2 exceptions: AC power (not from the inverter), and an ignition signal.

If you have an Onan generator (which I'm sure you do) it's compatible.

Here is the Post which has explicit instructions to do the install. Gary said they were spot-on.

I'll let you know how it goes.

smlranger · 05-09-2007, 04:56 PM

OK guys, this is the one I am referring to:

http://www.rvupgradestore.com/index....ROD&ProdID=894

Apparently it is only compatible with the RS series inverters and their remote panels. I have the older style remote panel with my Xantrex Freedom inverter.

Pusherman: I will look into that. I had checked the Onan site which strongly discouraged owner installation of the EC30 due to wiring complexities. If it can be done in the One Place panel with running a wire to the ignition circuit, certainly sounds do-able. Not sure if there is 120VAC behind the One Place panel that is not tied to the inverter. In my rig, all the AC outlets and appliances seem to run on the inverter. I guess the service panel under the bed with the breakers for the AC/Heat Pump is a potential source.

Pusherman · 05-09-2007, 05:25 PM

Gary,

I read the same warning on the Onan site. I am pretty comfortable with electrical work, and after seeing Garybtt's install and his coaching, it doesn't sound so intimidating to me. Probably an 8 hour job.

You can get 110V from the engine block heater switch at the One Place, but it's also apparently powered by the inverter. So the trick is to find 110V not powered by the inverter, install a 110V to 12V transformer, and run the 12V line to the One Place location (where you install the EC-30). That plus the ignition wire sounds like the challenge.

Just ordered the EC-30 today. Will let you know how it goes.

smlranger · 05-09-2007, 05:39 PM

I just read over the install instructions provided by Garybtt and that is very helpful (thanks Gary!). It does sound fairly straight-forward.

Pusherman...go for it and I'll wait to hear your report.

Cruzer · 05-10-2007, 05:12 AM

I installed the Xantrex AGS module designed to interface with the RS series inverter on my 2004 Allegro Bus. It worked really well and interfaced with the same System Control Panel (SCP) that controlled my RS2000 inverter and anything else on the network.

However, the SCP requires a power supply to manage the network. The AGS module does not have a network buss power supply in it. If you are not using an RS series inverter you need to buy an external power supply module from Xantrex to power the network.

On my 2004, my choice was to replace the Freedom 458 with the RS2000 and then add the AGS module. That way I had true sine wave power as well as AGS capability.

My 2007 Bus came with the Onan EC30 AGS module. I replaced the OEM RV3012 modified sine wave inverter with an RS3000 and added the SCP. But, this time I left the OEM EC-30 rather than add the Xantrex AGS module - mainly because it was already there.

The EC30 offers one advantage over the Xantrex AGS. The Xantrex AGS has no provision for testing for shore power. If you leave your coach plugged with pets on-board on a warm day and the shore power fails it would be nice to auto start the genset when the thermostat calls for AC. Unfortunately the Xantrex AGS module starts the genset when in auto mode even if the shore power is present. I had to do a work around by installing a shore power fired relay to break the thermostat signal feeds to the AGS module to overcome this. The Onan EC30 has shore power sense leads so you can connect direct to their optional 120 VAC/12 VAC transformer to make this function without having to do any workaround relay stuff. The only drawback to the Onan is that the EC30 has a safety input that can get goofy once in a while. You need to reset it by releasing the turning the key on, park brake, and resetting the park brake if you haven't used the AGS module within the last 30 days.

While I like the Xantrex AGS best, if you do the relay workaround, it's an awful lot of work and extra expense if you don't have an RS series inverter. In that case I'd recommend going with the Onan EC30.

cbeierl · 05-10-2007, 08:01 AM

From the Xantrex AGS docs Automatic Generator Start Owner's Guide it looks like the optional external shutdown input (wires 5&6) could be used with a 12V transformer on the shore power line to suppress AutoStart when shore power is present.

vicsryd · 05-10-2007, 08:09 AM

smlranger,
Xantrex does list a AGS for Freedom inverter systems on their web site here.

Pusherman,
I ordered a EC-30 last week too as we have a lot of dry camping coming up this season.. Been figuring out what I want to do for shore power sense and the safety hook. I've determined the information in the post/discussion you reference above has some inaccuracies/gaps. I'm going back to that discussion and post my thoughts if you want to have more food for thought.

smlranger · 05-10-2007, 10:22 AM

Jon,

Thanks. Not sure how I missed that when I checked their web site yesterday....

Looks like it is not designed to sense loss of shore power to start genset but primarily uses thermostat and battery voltage as triggers.