Electrical issues (2017 Winnebago Tour 42QD)

[Winn17TourQD]

Still in Naples… getting high voltage warning inside coach. Went outside to post , I have a 50 progressive industries surge protector both line show good and no codes. Called the offic e they sent someone out he could not find issue with shore post. Couldn’t start genny, when I did all the lights went out. Calle a mobile rv place South RV . We started by replacing ally the house batteries. That now let the genny start.
Went to beach , came back high voltage beeper going off again and saying that batteries are depleted.
I did get the genny to start, will run while I go get some dinner . But I have no clue what is going on.. this has been going on for a solid week.
I appreciate any one who can point me in a direction that will remedy this electrical issue.
Thanks
Phil

[powercat_ras]

You might want to add to your post what model of RV you have and what year.

You might also want to be more specific about what kind of Progressive Industries Protector you have.

You might also want to be more specific about where the high voltage beeper is coming from, and where the message saying batteries are depleted is coming from.

Thanks.

[Lv2Roam2]

If the shore power checked our OK, consider removing the surge protector and then looking at your transfer switch and inverter - carefully...

[Morich]

Since we are lacking info on things, we can't really do much for a solution but I might throw out some ideas on what I "suspect" is happening.
I feel like there is far more confusion than good!

The "high voltage" alarm is one to start sorting. Where does it indicate high voltage as it sounds far more likely to be low battery voltage on the coach batteries! From there the confusion seems to have multiplied or what I read is not what you meant?
Confusing to me when you say you couldn't start the genset but when you did the lights went out??? Not able to start the generator but when you start it? Did it start or not start as it can't do both!
When you say the "lights went out"? Do you mean the alarm light went out? Or did the inside lights go out?

But having a guy change the batteries seems to be a pretty bold move. What I feel is happening without better info is that the alarm is actually telling you the batteries are too low to let the inverter produce AC power!

If your transfer switch is bad in a way that you are not getting shore power, that would explain the batteries going down and in turn that would explain why the generator would not start!

But if you are telling us you finally got the generator to start after starting the RV engine, that would explain a lot of things.
The RV engine running should connect power from the engine alternator to both the coach and chassis batteries and that would then give plenty of power to start the generator. Once the generator is running, you should then have full AC power in the coach as the transfer switch would likely switch over to it, even if the shore power is not connecting through.

I suspect you got a bum steer from the repair folks and the real problem might be the transfer switch has a loose connection on the shore power. At that point the load was dumped on the batteries powering the inverter and they went down to the point you got an alarm. But not a high voltage alarm but low voltage letting you know you were about to lose all electrical power!

See if this fits what happened?
1.You lost shore power due to a fault, possibly in the transfer switch.
2. The load then ran the batteries down and you got an alarm which was confused as
high voltage on the AC line.
3. The line checked good at the post and that part was correct.
4. The batteries were run down so you were unable to start the generator.
5. New charged batteries were installed and that let you start the generator.
6. Everything seems to work as long as the generator is running but the shore power
will still be likely to have a fault.

It needs somebody with a meter to check the path for the voltage but another way to verify /look for a fault is to open the lid of the transfer switch and look for burned spots from arcing!
That is a semi-common problem!

[Winn17TourQD]

2017 Winnebago Tour 42QD
On my way down here from Indy , generator would not start. Every time I tried to start it , it knocked out everything that was on in the coach lights everything. That was problem one coming down here.
Then when plugged into shore I kept getting high voltage readings on display center of my coach. 129 to 131 which gives off the low but annoying alarm sound to check the display.
So I go outside check connections, good check the surge protector it’s good showing 114 and 119 ( progressive Industry end pt50x
So I call the mobile rv peeps. He said let’s start with batteries as they are original and are hot and swollen. Once installed genny fired right up ! Let I run for a half hour with a load. Shut it down , reconnected at the shore. 15 later high voltage alarm again 130 showing on coach screen, but when I went outside ,showed in range on the surge, an no errors.
I think there is still an issue at the pole , and also an issue as to why these new batteries are not changing even just running the genny?

[Winn17TourQD]

I just the genny off. As it’s just wasting fuel, batteries are not charging, they are depleting now at 10.1 on the coaches screen readout. I’m lost!

[l1v3fr33ord1]

Phil-

I'm not an electrician. I'm passing this on from a recent thread over on iRV2:

High voltage on one leg of a 50A coach indicates a loose neutral wire.

I'm with Steve and Richard. As the Progressive Industries PTX-50 indicates power is OK at the pole, the likely cause is in the coach. Use a meter to check:

- the power cord at the coach end
- the power cord reel (the rotating contacts seem a common place for connections to fail)
- the transfer switch

Tighten any connections that you find are loose. Be very careful- 120V electricity can kill you.

The wiring diagrams for your coach are available here.

If the inverter/charger is on the high-voltage leg it may decline to operate, which would explain why the house batteries are running down.

[Winn17TourQD]

The generator did not charge r the batteries either. If that helps.

[LOG]

Remove the surge protector. Plug into power pole. Plug a volt meter, such as the P4400 Kill A Watt meter, into a 120 volt outlet in the coach. If still showing high voltage, call a electrician.

[Morich]

Okay, one other small bit of info we need to look at the right drawing for sure?
Not to be picky but there were two different builds of that year and model, early has a 1 as the 7th digit of the serial number and a 2 if built later in the year.
There should be a label somewhere near the drivers side, if this is not handy info to find but if you can tell us which, we can be more sure of our info!

Meanwhile we might pass along some ideas to check. But this is from the early build, so if it doesn't look right, it may be because I have guessed wrong!

Power should come in on the cord to the reel and transfer switch at the side and then go to a breaker panel at the driver's side near back near batteries. If you find that true, look at the breaker panel there as there is a main breaker which may be tripped. Also while there look at the smaller breakers for any sticking out/tripped.

Yellow item in this drawing is main breaker. Click this snip to get a better view!


What I think is happening is the 110AC power is not getting to an inverter charger. The charger section is what takes the ac in and makes it 12 volt DC to run the inside 12volt things like lights, fans, and water pump plus charge the coach batteries.
This set of coach batteries are on the passenger side, maybe 6 of them? If the charger is not getting power or not working right the new batteries will run down pretty quick and the generator will no longer start!
Keep in mind it is not good for batteries to run fully down, so avoid doing that if you can.
If you find no breakers bad at the back, try to hear the charger and tell if it is humming. They often hum when they are working hard. I'm guessing this is not working and not charging the batteries.


But there is a system which can be confusing things as it connects the chassis batteries together with the coach when the RV engine is running!
If the chassis start battery is okay and you start the engine, the coach batteries may then begin to charge from the engine alternator.
This charges slowly and you won't want the engine running for 6-8 hours but it may help to see if that works.
The repair folks did not do you a good job if they just put in new batteries and did not check if they were being charged!!

Overall simple view is this? lots of detail left out but how the power flows.


I left off the engine alternator and chassis batteries but they connect to the coach batteries when engine is running! I think the problem will that the power is not getting past the red mark, so the charger is not working.
It "could" be the charger is not working even if getting power but my guess is it not getting power??

[Winn17TourQD]

Thanks, gives me areas to start looking… the rv guy who put the batteries in, should be here soon .. but if he can’t figure it out either, I’ll call Winnebago, cut my vacation losses, and try to get it in a facility somewhere…. I’ve had one good one week trip so far with this thing. Wife not happy at all. This vacation is ruined for sure. Already sunk over 20k in tires, batteries and other crap that has gone wrong.. definitely not feeling good about this coach! Thanks for letting me vent. Phil

[Morich]

YUP! With you on the costs. Everything we do for fun seems to wind up costing twice what we expect!
Boating? A boat is a hole in the water where you put your money!

RV? A hole in your wallet where you spend your time!

Motel? A place where you you spend time and money wishing you were somewhere else!

Stay home in the garden? Where you put your time and money and still wish it would rain so you could go in the house!!
NOT good!
Might as well

[Winn17TourQD]

7 th digit is a 2

[Morich]

One big quick thing to check? Make sure the coach battery disconnect switch is on. Push the switch after being sure the coach batteries have some power.
It can get really tricky at times if the batteries get down too far.
The disconnect switch is a momentary that we push it to engage the relay tied to it but when we let the switch go, it "bounces back" instead of staying flipped. You might be able to feel it being different than lots of switches?
What can happen is we push the switch to ward turning it on but if the batteries are too low, the relay doesn't move to connect as it is designed with a magnet gizmo that keeps it in the last position, either on or off!
This saves using battery full time to hold the relay closed but it can confuse us!!
If we push the switch toward turned on while the batteries are dead and don't notice it doesn't stay, we can put good batteries in and since we KNOW we turned them on, it still doesn't work!
To make it worse, this switch and relay have to be on/ connected for the charger to get power to the batteries.
That has to be screwy for new users! It has a reason but it looks like designed to mess with our mind??

Just as a check I suggest try this.
Start the RV engine as a way to get the alternator and chassis batteries connected to the coach batteries. That's meant to let us get a little charge in them as we drive. But it also is more sure to give us power in all the places we want it.

Then try pushing the switch toward closing the disconnect. That should assure the relay moves to the right place and connects the charge voltage to the batteries if all is working right! If you have a meter, looking at both the chassis and coach batteries, they should read the same as they are connected!
If watching the battery voltage and rev up the engine, you should see that voltage go up and down with the motor speed!

Not trying to blow your mind, just a small point that could be ruining the trip? But if this were true, the inside lights , etc will not work either, so not high hopes for that as cause!
Just trying to find a reason to smile?

[LOG]

Have you put a volt meter on one of the 120 volt outlets?

[powercat_ras]

1. Do you ever get the high voltage alarm when using the generator? I'm assuming not.

If my "not" assumption is valid, then the loose or open neutral is either in the shore cable or in the transfer switch shore cable side.

2. Does everything else like Microwave Oven work off generator power? I'm assuming so. If so then the circuit breaker inside the generator is not tripped. If nothing works off generator power then the breakers in the generator may have tripped.

3. Have you opened the door on your power center inside the RV and made sure no breakers are tripped?

4. In a high end coach like yours, you probally have a Magnum or similar combination inverter-converter-charger in the basement. This what charges the batteries, or is a major drain on the batteries when you are not on shore power or generator power and have the inverter on. In your high end coach it may just always be on to run residential refrigerator unless you expressly turn it off.

You probally have a manual for it in your supplement manuals book or a separate manual in your Manual bag. It may have circuit breakers on it, it may have a reset button, it may have LEDS that give you troubleshooting information.

5. In the future don't let your batteries run down to 10.5 volts anymore. This is really reducing their useful life. I'm sure you spent a lot of money on them and you want to get a qualified RV tech to fix this as soon as possible. If you want your batteries to last more than a couple of years you don't want to let them run down below 12.3 volts

6. I know it is painful but you really want to take a few hours and get out your manual bag and look at the Operators Manual and Supplemental Manuals for your Tour. It has so many bells and whistles that are described in these and it is important for you to understand how to use them and how they all work to enjoy your RV and take care of it.

Good luck.

[Winn17TourQD]

Ok, the person from rv south came out to check my coach, he put the batteries in the other day and when he left they were charging. Of course as soon as he left they stopped.
The campground brought over an extension cord to use the shore next door as it’s vacant. This pole seems to read more even 122 121 we’re gonna use that one.
Plugged in , heard the transfer switch , went inside to the breaker box, checked every hot and neutral. Tugged a little on each to make sure secure. Everything tested fine. I went to the back to see if any of the mains had tripped, they had not but I reset both just for giggles. I went back in the coach where he was still testing circuits. Heard a humming sound , so I looked at the coach screen. It was charging… he was like hey you are charging.. . I’m like , really, it hasn’t been charging for over 24 hours. We went to look at the inverter/ charger it was running. He was not happy with the design. As the frt was bolted face into the wall. At this time we didn’t do anything with it as it was now running.
I’m telling you, I have a serious gremlin in there.
So, for now everything is on and working. He advised to keep an eye on it to make sure in continues to charge.
Best gues as to why it’s running now , when I turned off several breakers this morning in an attempt to conserve power and get a toilet to flush , it may have been enough time for the inverter to reset???? Charger running now but outer box is hot, I don’t know if this is normal. But it is running.
The tech was super nice and very informative.! He did want to charge me anything.. and he was here for forty minutes checking things out with his meter. I have him a hundred anyway a told him to take his wife to lunch.
He said if it stopped again to order a new inverter and he’d install it.
Been running for about an hour and a half. So far, so good!

[Winn17TourQD]

Wife came out and said im getting the high voltage alarm again. And by alarm it makes a noise at the control center about every five seconds. I’m beginning to think this coach may be a little sensitive????? Have been on two different shore powers here . Don’t know how hot the inverter is suppose to get , so i’m keeping the door open a little.
Wife said when she turned the ac down to get more ac the warning came on, when she turned it back up (warm) it went off.
That’s all for now . Thanks all ! It definitely takes a village to take care of me��

[Winn17TourQD]

Actually her ac choices were in reverse, she went to make it warmer, high voltage beep , then turned it back down to silence the beep. As it used more power

[Lv2Roam2]

Did the tech pull the cover on the transfer switch and check the input / output voltage on shore power and at least the output voltage on the generator? If that's good it's time to look again at the inverter. Magnum has a decent help line and the techs can walk you through some diagnostics that include what the settings are on your power management system, how to do a soft and hard inverter reset, etc. I recommend you work with Magnum before replacing the inverter.