Mercedes Sprinter service

[BlueGekko]

We have a 2019 Winnie Navion D with 8200 miles. Two weeks ago, while on the road to Boothbay, ME, the check engine light came on. After setting up camp I checked the manual and found I had 500 miles or 16 starts before the vehicle wouldn’t start again. Went on line to find a Nearby Mercedes dealer and called them all. Only one, 3 hrs away, could get the Navion into the shop for diagnosis and then only if I had a reservation. Earliest reservation was 3 wks away. Checked with home state, NH, and found a similar situation. Only one MB dealer in the entire state (5 hrs away from Boothbay) could handle the Navion. Is this the situation across the US or is New England “special”? Planning a trip to Alaska in May, 21 - if all the stars align - and want to be prepared for long tow truck rides (and adequate insurance coverage) if this situation is common. Thanks for any reassurance ir commiseration.

[Winterbagoal]

Not really enough info to diagnose the check engine problem, but my 2017 chassis manual suggests a problem with the exhaust gas after treatment, based on your 500 miles or 16 starts symptoms. Is your DEF tank full? Any way you could verify that? Maybe buy a jug or head to a nearby truckstop and try to add? If it's full, then on to commiseration.
I can't speak for the New England area, but one of the main Achilles heels of the MB Sprinter chassis is it's general lack of conveniently located "qualified workshops". My nearest MB dealer that's Sprinter capable is 60 miles away. There may be other heavy truck style shops nearer that can do it, but I haven't had to explore that situation yet. Is there a Freightliner shop near you? Some of them will be able to help with the diesel idiosyncrasies.

[BlueGekko]

My MB chassis handbook lists all kinds of Potential life threatening and near vehicle death problems associated with any number if combinations of dash hazard/engine lights but the only caution when it’s only the engine light is to hie myself to a repair shop before the miles or starts limitations expire. And if I read the manual correctly, I can’t just pay a mechanic to somehow turn the cel off, the “problem” has to actually be fixed and then a MB wizard must pass his/her wand over it to reassure the engine god that all is well. Fortunately, I’m still in warranty and all I’ve lost is 3 weeks on the road. Oh yes, there’s a separate dash light for low DEF but it hasn’t come on. Will, however, top up DEF to see if it has any effect. Will also do a search for Freightliner shops, though that may be a diminishing resource as MB recently announced that Freightliner will no longer be building Sprinters.

[Winterbagoal]

From my OM, page 198

"Problem Possible causes/consequences and M Solutions
; The yellow Check
Engine indicator
lamp is lit while
the engine is running.
The exhaust gas aftertreatment is malfunctioning or an emission relevant
malfunction has occurred. This malfunction or defect can damage
the exhaust gas aftertreatment.
After the first message and under normal operating conditions, you
can drive on for up to approximately 500 mi (800 km). Then a warning
tone sequence sounds and the engine can only be started another 16
times.
X Observe the messages in the display.
X Have the exhaust gas aftertreatment checked immediately at a
qualified specialist workshop.
In some states it is legally prescribed that after the Check Engine
indicator lamp lights up you must contact a qualified specialist workshop
immediately. Observe the legal requirements."

It's the only place in my manual that references 500miles or 16 starts.
Search the internet for DEF gauge inaccurate, or some such. They are finnickey.
I only suggest checking the DEF level because it's part of the "exhaust gas aftertreatment" system, and it's easy to check or fill.
At this point, you have nothing to lose.

[BlueGekko]

You’re right. Nothing to lose so I’ll fill the DEF tank tomorrow. Unfortunately, I haven’t counted the number of starts since seeing the cel so I won’t restart the thing until I’m on my way to the dealer to check the cel. I’ll post when I learn “the rest of the story”. Thanks.

[AJMike]

Originally Posted by BlueGekko

Only one, 3 hrs away, could get the Navion into the shop for diagnosis and then only if I had a reservation. Earliest reservation was 3 wks away.

I am sorry to hear of your problems. This is exactly the nightmare I worried about when we were looking for a new RV, and the reason we got a Fuse on the Ford Transit chassis rather than the more appealing MB chassis models. But, even with the Ford diesel, service choices are more limited than with just the Ford gasser and only some of the Ford dealers where we live will work on a Ford Transit based RV. As for MB, only the single dealer in this area will work on them and their backlog is substantial.

As much as I like the mileage I get from the Ford diesel and as much as I like the power it seems to have our next RV, if there is a next RV for us, will probably be a gasser.

Best of luck in getting your problems taken care of.

[BlueGekko]

Drove the hour and a half to the Scarborough, ME MB dealer for my appointment madr 2 wks ago. The del wad on the entire way and I was sweating bullets that I’d exceed the 500 mile limit as described in my 2018 MB chassis handbook. P200 for those following along with the bouncing ball. Parked at MB, left vehicle running for fear that it wouldn’t start again (again, p200), and passed the keys off to the tech. 2:5 hrs later the customer service rep says it’s ready to go. The tech pulled it into the shop, turned it off and plugged in the diagnostic equipment. No errors. Tech turned the engine on, no cel. Though I’d been driving it with the cel lit for close to 500 miles, there was no record in memory that it had been on. I mentioned to the customer service rep that I was afraid I’d go into limp mode before I reached the dealer. He said MB stopped wiring their Sprinters (for cel only) that way in 2012. Limp mode is still a real thing if your cel and low DEF lights are on. Also, with only cel on, there is no 500 mile limit. So three hours of road time and two and a half hours of waiting and I’m still puzzled but a bit smarter about the dash lights and limitations. Fortunately, it was all warranty service so no bill. AND it’s the dealership’s policy to car wash every vehicle before it leaves to lot. Not a real good day but it could have been worse. Still unsure if I should trust the rep about the 500 mile issue or the handbook. Anyone have any experience with the ghost cel or 600 mile limitation? Finally, AJMike, since MB has allowed Freightliner and Dodge to build and service Sprinters in the US, there may be more options available to troubleshoot/repair Sprinters than the Ford diesels. Hopefully, I’ll never find out but it’s food for thought. Maybe you’ll think about it again next time you try to cross over the Rockies and are stuck doing 25mph in a gasser in the breakdown lane. That was my “Ah hah” moment when I enviously watched the diesels zoom past me. And the Sprinter’s 17 mpg (my average from TX to the mountains of NH) sealed the deal. But, then, it also depends on the kind of driving you do and where you go. So, I wish everyone clean highways, good weather and a beautiful overnight spot.

[AJMike]

Originally Posted by BlueGekko

AJMike, since MB has allowed Freightliner and Dodge to build and service Sprinters in the US, there may be more options available to troubleshoot/repair Sprinters than the Ford diesels. Hopefully, I’ll never find out but it’s food for thought. Maybe you’ll think about it again next time you try to cross over the Rockies and are stuck doing 25mph in a gasser in the breakdown lane. That was my “Ah hah” moment when I enviously watched the diesels zoom past me. And the Sprinter’s 17 mpg (my average from TX to the mountains of NH) sealed the deal. But, then, it also depends on the kind of driving you do and where you go. So, I wish everyone clean highways, good weather and a beautiful overnight spot.

Good to know about the Freightliner and Dodge service centers.

We do a fair amount of traveling in relatively remote places like the Texas panhandle between El Paso and San Antonio (at least once and perhaps twice a year) where there are no large towns at all and I had assumed that I was more likely to find a Ford dealer to service the Ford 3.2L diesel than I would to service the MB diesel. Perhaps that is wrong.

As for the diesel in our Fuse, as a general rule I really like it. It has plenty of power, I climb steep hills at about 55, get between 17 and 19 mpg provided I watch my speed and am generally a fan. However my recent experience with the DEF module in the engine was less than pleasant and has soured me somewhat on diesels in general. Still since our Fuse is relatively new (2018) I don't expect to be buying a new RV in the immediate future. If we find ourselves in that position I will think about your gasser comment.

[Winterbagoal]

Sometimes just drive them far enough, and the CEL or error causing it will clear. I've seen that remedy once in a while on the various forums for a variety of problems.
Early on when learning the nuances of driving the 24' long Navion, I had the CEL for ESP/ASR light up on my 2017 chassis, after some particularly intense crosswind buffeting while driving at freeway speeds, and again after some intense curb roll entering/exiting some steep driveways. In all cases, they cleared on their own after a few start/drive/stop cycles.
btw, thanks for posting up the results. It may save someone else the frustration and worry about LHM. I was also less than impressed driving our 26' Sunstar gasser up any kind of grade. The engine noise under the doghouse at 4500RPM and the rapid fuel consumption were 2 of my (now) favorite reasons for switching to the MB diesel.

[BlueGekko]

Winterbagoal, I forgot to mention in my last post that the MB techs had seen the cel problem before but couldn’t explain it. Presumably, someone is providing feedback to the MB mothership because, in my case, the dealership will probably bill the mothership for the 2.5 hours they spent on my problem. Multiply that by however many folks have/are experiencing the same cel problem and I’m sure a beancounter somewhere will notice. I am somewhat bothered by the seeming conflicting info about the 500 mile limitation and would like to nail that down in case the cel problem recurs. Will have to wait to see what the Sprinter community has experienced. And, finally, yes, I’d forgotten how noisy the V10 was in my Thor gasser. On the bright side, I had many hours of uninterrupted thoughts and mental observations about the passing scenery because, even on the flats, the noise was too much for DW to talk over except to occasionally bark “turn right!” or “turn left!”. Nowadays, in a much quieter cockpit, my ears are steadily learning to tune out a certain frequency range. If you know what I mean. ��

[AJMike]

Originally Posted by BlueGekko

I forgot to mention in my last post that the MB techs had seen the cel problem before but couldn’t explain it.

I suppose I should know, but I don't. What does "cel" stand for?

[BlueGekko]

Check engine light. With all the abbreviations I see on the boards, I sometimes think I’m back in the service speaking that unique language.

[Winterbagoal]

Originally Posted by BlueGekko

Winterbagoal, I forgot to mention in my last post that the MB techs had seen the cel problem before but couldn’t explain it. Presumably, someone is providing feedback to the MB mothership because, in my case, the dealership will probably bill the mothership for the 2.5 hours they spent on my problem. Multiply that by however many folks have/are experiencing the same cel problem and I’m sure a beancounter somewhere will notice. I am somewhat bothered by the seeming conflicting info about the 500 mile limitation and would like to nail that down in case the cel problem recurs. Will have to wait to see what the Sprinter community has experienced. And, finally, yes, I’d forgotten how noisy the V10 was in my Thor gasser. On the bright side, I had many hours of uninterrupted thoughts and mental observations about the passing scenery because, even on the flats, the noise was too much for DW to talk over except to occasionally bark “turn right!” or “turn left!”. Nowadays, in a much quieter cockpit, my ears are steadily learning to tune out a certain frequency range. If you know what I mean. ��

When I/we first got the Navion, we had many questions, as we'd never had a diesel powered vehicle before, much less one with an SCR/DPF/DEF system. Our concerns were amplified by many of the forum threads describing all sorts of CEL causes and fixes. I remember asking my Service Adviser, after I had the A Service done, whether or not I would be stranded in the middle of nowhere in LMH (we were considering another Alaska trip in the Navion) if the Service B reminder popped up and we couldn't get it done. He assured me that it wouldn't put us in limp home mode, which was a relief. Sounds funny now, but at the time, we were really concerned, because we didn't know what to expect. I eventually decided to try not to worry too much about it, and just deal with each new challenge when they occur. Not much else we can do, is there?
Yes, at 4500+RPMs with the V10 about 3 feet from your seat, it's all about the noise, the inconvenient position of the doghouse which partially blocks access to your seats, and the complete absence of anything resembling fuel economy, as the RPMs increase. We did one tour in the Sunstar and (she) decided to trade it in when we got home. I think we put about 4600 miles on it round trip, but that was enough to know we bought the wrong motorhome. We went to our dealer, she saw a low profile Navion, and we ordered one ourselves. To date, it's been pretty close to flawless.
AJ: CEL = Check Engine Light - usually on dash somewhere, and always annoying.
(welcome to "Acronyms R Us")

[BlueGekko]

Winterbagoal, we’re in that boat now. Had planned to leave with new Navion for Alaska at end of last May. Now looking forward to end of May, 21. I’m not reassured by an advisor who won’t be anywhere near me when limp mode kicks in but, as you say, you sometimes have to jump out of the plane and trust you’ve done everything you could do to ensure you don’t splat. Aside from the cel incident, we’re happy with the Navion and are looking forward to our next road trip. Happy trails.

[Winterbagoal]

Originally Posted by BlueGekko

Winterbagoal, we’re in that boat now. Had planned to leave with new Navion for Alaska at end of last May. Now looking forward to end of May, 21. I’m not reassured by an advisor who won’t be anywhere near me when limp mode kicks in but, as you say, you sometimes have to jump out of the plane and trust you’ve done everything you could do to ensure you don’t splat. Aside from the cel incident, we’re happy with the Navion and are looking forward to our next road trip. Happy trails.

Copy that. Winterbagoal out.

[BlueGekko]

AJMike, what I think I forgot to mention regarding the scarcity of MB dealers in NH and ME is that I was referring to those dealerships with repair bays large enough to accommodate a motorhome. There are many more MB dealers in those states but they can’t get a motorhome into their shops. This may be the same situation regarding service for Ford diesels so when you call for assistance, be sure to tell them how high your vehicle is.

[Satx View]

Since this thread is about Sprinter service, thought I'd post this here. We're newbies to RV life, so forgive me in advance if I bring up stupid things as I vent. We bought a 2021 View on June 2 and have made two 5,000 mile trips and are getting ready to leave on a longer one. Between trips, at about 6,000 miles, we got a really loud hammering noise from the area of the left front wheel that went on for about 10 minutes, through stops, starts, pulling over a couple of times, etc. before it just faded away. We already had an appointment for some issues, so we drove directly to our MB dealer with it and thoroughly described the incident. We were there within about 15 minutes from the incident. They kept it for three days and gave it back and said they couldn't find anything. Based on their description, I think they just drove it around the block and it didn't make the noise so they didn't really pursue it. It was coming from the wheel area and they clearly hadn't touched anything based on the dirt patterns. As we left, my feeling was that they didn't really believe me. It wasn't exactly a condescending attitude, but pretty close. A couple of weeks later, we were on the next long trip and after about 4 hours of driving one day, it started again. This time we made a video of the steering wheel and dash with full noise. You can even see vibration in the instrument cluster along with the really loud hammering noise.

I left a voicemail and emailed our dealer and they asked for the video, which I sent. It's been 10 days and nothing. I went over there on Friday morning and the service adviser said he had watched it and gave it to a Sprinter tech and they hadn't had time to talk about it. He didn't have any suggestions, but said they would talk about it and get back to me that afternoon. This week we're leaving on the longest trip yet and I can't believe we're sitting here wondering if it is going to fly apart as we're driving down the road.

I'm not looking for warm 'n fuzzies from Mercedes, but I am looking for some sign that they give a s***. So far, no sign of one. This dealer has a huge Sprinter department and we went into this hoping for better service. Maybe they only care about servicing Sprinters they actually sold. Anyway, are there any MB dealers out there who care about working on a Sprinter based RV?

[rprochnow]

To be fair, it can be difficult to reproduce intermittent problems - on any vehicle when you take it in for service. While having the video may illustrate what happened, it may not help them identify what is wrong.

Years ago, I had a Lexus with intermittent rattles. When they couldn't reproduce it at the dealership, I asked to ride with the service advisor and help them identify the problem. They drove to the street near our house, which was particularly bad - and we were able to reproduce the problem.

It would help the MB dealer considerably if you could determine how to reproduce the problem - either on a specific road or following a sequence of actions - something you could then demonstrate for the dealer, so they'd have a starting point.

If you are able to reproduce the problem reliably, and the MB dealer still isn't able to help, then either find another MB dealer, contact your Winnebago dealer, or contact Winnebago - for assistance.

[Winterbagoal]

Originally Posted by Satx View

Since this thread is about Sprinter service, thought I'd post this here. We're newbies to RV life, so forgive me in advance if I bring up stupid things as I vent. We bought a 2021 View on June 2 and have made two 5,000 mile trips and are getting ready to leave on a longer one. Between trips, at about 6,000 miles, we got a really loud hammering noise from the area of the left front wheel that went on for about 10 minutes, through stops, starts, pulling over a couple of times, etc. before it just faded away. We already had an appointment for some issues, so we drove directly to our MB dealer with it and thoroughly described the incident. We were there within about 15 minutes from the incident. They kept it for three days and gave it back and said they couldn't find anything. Based on their description, I think they just drove it around the block and it didn't make the noise so they didn't really pursue it. It was coming from the wheel area and they clearly hadn't touched anything based on the dirt patterns. As we left, my feeling was that they didn't really believe me. It wasn't exactly a condescending attitude, but pretty close. A couple of weeks later, we were on the next long trip and after about 4 hours of driving one day, it started again. This time we made a video of the steering wheel and dash with full noise. You can even see vibration in the instrument cluster along with the really loud hammering noise.

I left a voicemail and emailed our dealer and they asked for the video, which I sent. It's been 10 days and nothing. I went over there on Friday morning and the service adviser said he had watched it and gave it to a Sprinter tech and they hadn't had time to talk about it. He didn't have any suggestions, but said they would talk about it and get back to me that afternoon. This week we're leaving on the longest trip yet and I can't believe we're sitting here wondering if it is going to fly apart as we're driving down the road.

I'm not looking for warm 'n fuzzies from Mercedes, but I am looking for some sign that they give a s***. So far, no sign of one. This dealer has a huge Sprinter department and we went into this hoping for better service. Maybe they only care about servicing Sprinters they actually sold. Anyway, are there any MB dealers out there who care about working on a Sprinter based RV?

Is there any way you could put the video up on here?
Maybe someone has had a similar issue?

[Satx View]

Originally Posted by Winterbagoal

Is there any way you could put the video up on here?
Maybe someone has had a similar issue?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gNNLrUT25lQ

Here's a link to the video. Thanks