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Old 04-13-2023, 07:53 PM   #1
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Electrical short somewhere 2020 Micro Minnie 1808FBS

How does one trace down a 12 volt short? We went camping last week, everything worked good. Today there’s no 12 v other than the electric jack and light. Battery is fully charged. I reset the breaker inside the junction box behind the front crossmember. It popped about a minute later (stayed on just enough to get the slide half way out). then it popped a few more times while I was still under the camper trying to reset it. Last time I reset it, it sounded like it was sizzling then smoked a little bit, I don’t know if it popped again, I immediately got up and unhooked the battery. The 30amp fuse outside the junction box seems to be good.
Using a volt meter, with the battery unhooked, I have continuity between the positive wire posts and ground at the 30 amp fuse next to the junction box. And also continuity between ground and both posts on the breaker inside the junction box. All fuses in the distribution panel are good, even the 40 amp ones. No burnt fuses.
Does anybody have any ideas where to look next? I was thinking of pulling all the fuses and look for continuity between negative and each downward fuse plug, but it would be my guess those fuses would have blown before the 30 amp breaker in the junction box.
Is it possible the breaker in the junction box is bad? I’m sure it is now concidering it was sizzling and started smoking. But it did pop a few times before that. There must be a short somewhere, just not sure what to check next.
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Old 04-13-2023, 10:27 PM   #2
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Try checking the gnd wire in the junction box for a loose connection. Without a good ground, pos can trip fuses.
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Old 04-14-2023, 07:16 AM   #3
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Thank you Marine,
I’ll check that today. Also, I found a schematic of a 2108, thinking it’s similar to my 1808. The fuse outside the junction box is called an automatic breaker on the schematic. Do you know if that is like a fuse? Ir does it reset itself after it cools? Like in a vacuumed cleaner.
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Old 04-14-2023, 08:43 AM   #4
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Since you have verified that there is a problem, to avoid blowing/replacing fuses or possibly damaging some wires, I would go a bit different. Before putting power back on anything, I would go through the trailer to any breakers or fuses you can find and flip or remove them.
This will allow you to go back to the first point where power is added and test small sections at a time. It is possible to damage wires if they are overloaded repeatedly, so good idea not to do that!
The automatic breaker sounds like it should reset itself when it cools but check that !

When testing with a meter and checking continuity, be aware that you should not see any continuity from positive to negative side when there is not a load as when you have the breakers or fuses off. That is a good time to check the positive side to see if you see any ground on it! If you see ground on a positive wire when all the breakers and fuses are out, that is a clue! Find and repair that ground before putting power back!
It can be that you have missed a fuse, etc or it can also be a wire that has been damaged like in scraping on metal frame or boxes and that is what is tripping the power.
Fix the cause before putting power back as power on it too often can cause more damage!
On testing the negative/ground side of the circuit, you likely will see ground but that depends on how the circuit is designed.

When you are done testing the first section of wire, finding no continuity to ground on the positive side, try turning on or replacing one breaker or fuse to add one section of additional wiring then test again with the meter to see that you are getting a change.
Depending on what is on that circuit, you will likely begin to see continuity from positive side to ground! Don't let that surprise you as it is normal.
The positive wire goes out, through the fuse, to the wire going to some item in the RV. That item (like a light bulb?) will normally have a connection through it to the ground side. That is a normal good circuit (circle?) But the resistance of that continuity is something to try to judge.
When you check that continuity, the resistance you get will depend on the item it may be feeding. A single light bulb may have little resistance while a motor like a vent fan may show lots more resistance.
What you want to watch for is a positive wire that has really low resistance to ground. That may indicate that the positive wire is shorted to ground before getting to the item is should power!
Just as you mention, the smaller fuses/breakers should trip first if you have a short beyond them! Things are not always like we expect but it sounds like you will find the positive is shorted to ground after the breaker which has smoked but before it gets to the other fuse panel!
That's where cutting all the load off from that second panel will help cut the chase when first testing.

Something like this? Disconnecting as much of the system first and testing each small section as you add it will avoid replacing fuses and/or doing more damage as you go.

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I expect it should be a problem between the first breaker and any load centers you have! Guessing! But one place to look carefully is where that first breaker sets and maybe where the main wiring goes out of the box? Any signs of arcing?
But my guesses are bogus if you find different!
We would like to think the smaller breakers would go first but life has a way of tricking us!
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Old 04-14-2023, 09:52 AM   #5
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R1campr here is a drawing that may help. Turn off the battery disconnect in the pass through. I would try to locate a new 30 amp push button breaker and replace it, buy 2. Reset the new breaker. See if your slide works. If it does, remove all of the DC fuses in the panel. Turn the battery disconnect back on. If you could locate a clamp on DC amp meter to buy of borrow this would certainly improve your chance of finding the short. I use this one. https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1 When you plug in individual fuses you could see if there is current and how much. Plug in the fuses one at a time and see if the PB breaker trips.
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Old 04-14-2023, 12:26 PM   #6
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I found the problem. The red 6 gauge wire [ATTACH]Click image for larger version

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ID:	185653between the breaker and the cut off switch was pinched between the frame rail and the floor joist. I was getting + to - continuity at either end of that wire with the battery unhooked. Everything else was good. I think the breaker is still good too as I attached the slide out wires and hooked the battery back up, the slide works.
Good thing the camper didn’t catch fire. Will try and add a few pictures of the wire.
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Old 04-14-2023, 12:40 PM   #7
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R1campr a big CONGRATULATIONS. Good work.
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Old 04-14-2023, 02:22 PM   #8
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UGH! Good job finding!
But then it is not the best work to let a wire lay right on metal, so I might look at trying to slide something over the wires where they go through that spot. Any chance you could slit a short section of some scrap like a piece of old hose to slide over the wires and then slip it in to keep it off the metal in the future?
Looks like a place waiting to catch you when you are not ready!
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Old 04-14-2023, 02:35 PM   #9
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Nice work R1campr
These things work to protect wire:
A wire loom, purchased by the foot
An old piece of garden hose.
A 1x2 with a channel cut in the middle with a router.
All three are cheap
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Old 04-14-2023, 05:45 PM   #10
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I cut the piece off that was destroyed and used a splice kit to put it back together. The kit came with a heavy duty shrink tube. There was plenty of wire to route it where it was supposed to go, through a hole in the crossmember that has a plastic grommet in it. The wire went that way, but was caught between the frame and body after going through the hole.
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