Micro Minnie FLX Xantrex/Go Power! Parameters

[SactoSteve]

Hello RovingMedics-
This looks like a pretty handy feature for less that 30 amp service locations!
Thanks for bringing this to my attention.
-steve

[AzTom]

I am so happy I found this info. I just bought the FLX, at a huge discount, and have not pick it up yet. I came here searching for what type solar panel i could use for a plug in if needed.

I just got off the phone with the dealer to make sure they check all of this stuff.

[RovingMedics]

Originally Posted by AzTom

I am so happy I found this info. I just bought the FLX, at a huge discount, and have not pick it up yet. I came here searching for what type solar panel i could use for a plug in if needed.

I just got off the phone with the dealer to make sure they check all of this stuff.

I plugged in a Renogy 200w panel with wonderful results, FYI. More info coming soon.

[AzTom]

Thanks, I'm following this thread

[SactoSteve]

I believe this GoPower! table is just their "generic" configuration table and what would be nice to have is the WTOW (xantrax engineers recommendation) for the FLX system. Similar to what you posted for the Xantrex box.
-steve

[SactoSteve]

Needed to move the trailer but no power to jack. No power at all. Blue LED ring on battery was flashing. GoPower charger solar panel light was flashing.
Pressing the blue LED button restored system. Full voltage, but low Charge level (thought I took a screen shot, but apparently didn’t) I think it was in the 20s?

I suspect an over temperature condition? It’s been very hot in Sacramento, and the trailer is quite exposed to the sun. I have been curious about the lack of air circulation around the battery. I haven’t found any logging of fault conditions. Other possibilities could be overcharge or over discharge? Both seem unlikely (to me).
Sharing, FWIW.

-steve

[RovingMedics]

Originally Posted by SactoSteve

Needed to move the trailer but no power to jack. No power at all. Blue LED ring on battery was flashing. GoPower charger solar panel light was flashing.
Pressing the blue LED button restored system. Full voltage, but low Charge level (thought I took a screen shot, but apparently didn’t) I think it was in the 20s?

I suspect an over temperature condition? It’s been very hot in Sacramento, and the trailer is quite exposed to the sun. I have been curious about the lack of air circulation around the battery. I haven’t found any logging of fault conditions. Other possibilities could be overcharge or over discharge? Both seem unlikely (to me).
Sharing, FWIW.

-steve

uh oh. that's worrying. I checked on mine (storage near Wheatland) and it was doing fine. but you reminded me - I forgot to turn the power to my front jack to "off." oops. I'll be up there again on Wednesday though, so hopefully it's not dead.

Mine has been doing ok even with the high temperatures. I had the fridge set to Eco, freezer to Min, and it's been doing well. Battery was at 89% after I hadn't touched it for 2 weeks. it's sitting in plenty of sunlight.

do you have something else drawing power from it?

[SactoSteve]

do you have something else drawing power from it?

Not that I’m aware of. We have been leaving the fridge on, with no, previous issues.
We don’t have a separate power On/Off switch on the jack, just Up/Down.

[JoeMan]

Fantastic information on this thread. Question for the group. I live in the southeast and want to use the camper in the summer while traveling off grid. Based on the 110Volt Truma AC drawing 10.5AMP at maximum power - with a 320 AMP hour 12V battery, that would be about a 3 hour run time. That's not enough for running the AC at night while traveling. I think I could get by with 6 hours - is this a matter of just adding a second 320Amp Hour 12Volt battery in parallel? Would the other components support this addition assuming the proper connectors were used? Would this addition void any of the warranty?

[SactoSteve]

Originally Posted by Gregt

WTOW was kind enough to send me this configuration table of default and corrected settings. Hope this helps!


Attachment 183487

Gregt provided this community with a WTOW spread sheet of recommended configuration settings for the Xantrex Inverter/Charger. I found it invaluable in validating, and understanding, the required settings of that unit in the Micro Minnie FLX electrical system. Thank you Gregt.

I had been hoping to get the same thing from Winnebago for the GoPower! 30A MPPT Solar Charger, but I haven’t had any luck with Warranty or through our dealer. We, here on this board, have shared our developing knowledge and have, I think, pretty much got our systems working but still it would be nice to have validation of appropriate settings and perhaps an understanding of the rationale for the configuration.

I have compiled, and attached, a table of the GoPower! 30A MPPT Solar Charger Apps configurable settings to the level I understand them. I've populated corresponding values for each setting and provided some rationale, or questions, for each setting. >>>Warning<<< these are just my somewhat informed understandings and mostly not verified by any “source”.
Some are “no brainers”, like battery type and capacity, and some are probably “don’t care” like “Equalization Voltage” for a lithium battery, but I don’t know what the GoPower! 30A MPPT Solar Charger does with “don’t care” values. Some probably have acceptable values within some range. I think you’ll see what I am attempting with the table.

What I am asking is for those of us who have knowledge of some of these to provide feed back on this thread for discussion. Ideally WTOW could create such a product for the FLX community. In the meantime, if you can, please have a look and provide feedback where you can fill the voids, answer questions, correct errors, etc. Or even just opine. ;-)

-steve

[creativepart]

Originally Posted by SactoSteve

What I am asking is for those of us who have knowledge of some of these to provide feed back on this thread for discussion.

Steve, I feel for your pain. Honest I do, but pretty much with Solar Charge controllers you set them to the proper battery type and, unless you have some specific need to change the parameters, you don't need to set nor worry about the other items.

As just an FYI - the only batteries that need an Equalization phase are Flooded Lead Acid.

I looked at the PDF you posted and most everything looks normal for just about all Lithium battery systems. The High Voltage Disconnect looks pretty high. I'd expect to see 14.6v or 14.7v for this setting.

You have not detailed the exact model of GoPower controllers you have in your FLX (or I missed it if you did) but I think I found the manual for your unit - the MPPT 30. This might give you more info. Here's a link: https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/c...VC-30-MPPT.pdf

Winnebago is really dropping the ball on FLX owners (and don't get me started on the dealers). So, the worry and questions are normal. I would suggest calls to GoPower's support line would ease your mind about all of these things.

Here's a link to submit a ticket to GoPower support. I'd bet they can answer your questions.

https://support.gpelectric.com/new/

Here is the info that most important for your Lithium battery setup:

[SactoSteve]

Hello Creativepart
Thanks for your response!

The High Voltage Disconnect looks pretty high. I'd expect to see 14.6v or 14.7v for this setting

Glad you called this out. I think its the most telling example of why I have some modest concern, not fear or panic, about the lack of information.
This is a system, each separate element, aside from the panels, contains software making decisions. Presumably a systems engineer, system integrator, designed the system to operate in concert with each element. The High Voltage disconnect may be ok, or desired, to be that high to not interfere with the Batteries BMS actions? We just don't know. Most of the parameters, in the GoPower! Chart for lithium batteries are within an expected range for lithium batteries. And things like Equalization should be SW locked out when lithium battery is selected, but if you put a value in, mistakenly or not, for duration the configuration resets to “Custom”. That seems “iffy”. But who knows what is really going on?
Another related aspect is the note in the Lithionics documentation that the battery must self calibrate during its first cycle for maximum life and functionality. Was that done at the factory? At the dealer? Was the purchaser supposed to do that?

Like I said

We, here on this board, have shared our developing knowledge and have, I think, pretty much got our systems working but still it would be nice to have validation of appropriate settings and perhaps an understanding of the rationale for the configuration.

Rumors I’ve heard, unsubstantiated, are that Xantrex designed the FLX system. If so Winnebago should have gotten design information on the system. Such documentation would be handy. To say the least.

Thanks for your comments!
-Steve

[creativepart]

Originally Posted by SactoSteve

Rumors I’ve heard, unsubstantiated, are that Xantrex designed the FLX system.
-Steve

Based on how the other Lithionics equiped RVs in Winnebago line up I would "guess" - and that's all it is - that Lithionics developed or did so in concert with Xantrex.

I looked at Lithionics website and found the 320 ah UL listed OEM version of their battery - I believe this is what Winnebago is using. Does that seem right to you? The official name is:

12V 320AH E2107 GTX UL Battery OEM Model

So, there is some info there.

Here's a link to the Installation Manual and it has some of the info you need:

https://lithionicsbattery.com/wp-con...anual-RevE.pdf

Plus it says: Additionally, for factory support please send an email with your battery’s serial number to [email protected].

I doubt that your GoPower Solar Controller's Lithium settings are going to cause you any problems. But, here are your battery specs and preferred settings:

[SactoSteve]

FYI my questions sent with my GoPower Ticket

Although equalization is invalid for lithium batteries, are values needed to be entered for Equalize Voltage, Equalize duration, Equalize Interval even though interfacing with a lithium battery? If so what are the recommended values?

When Lithium is selected for battery type and a value in entered for absorption duration battery type changes to “custom”. The battery type can subsequently be re-entered as Lithium which then persists, as does the value previously entered for absorption duration.
Is the 120 min absorption duration value necessary for a lithium battery?
If so is the process described the recommended procedure to persist both Lithium battery type and Absorption duration?

High Voltage Disconnect seems redundant with the functioning of the Lithionics 12V 320AH E2107 GTX UL Battery OEM Model with internal BMS. Is the rather high 16 V GP default value intended to prevent conflicts between these 2 components? Is some other value more appropriate?

Are the following GoPower charger (GP-RVC-MPPT-30) values appropriate for interfacing with a Lithionics 12V 320AH E2107 GTX UL Battery OEM Model with internal BMS?
High Voltage Disconnect 16 V (GP default)
Bulk-Absorption voltage 14.6 V
Under Voltage Warning 12 V (GP default)
Discharge Limit Voltage 11 V (GP default)
Over-discharge Delay Time 10 S (GP default)
Over-discharge return (V) 12.8 V (GP default)
Float Voltage 13.6 V
Recharging Voltage 13.8 V

[SactoSteve]

Response received from GoPower!

Equalization is not used on any profile except for Flooded batteries. It is used to help remove sulfate build-up on the plates of a flooded battery. None of the values pertain to the use of lithium batteries.

I am not sure why the absorption duration does not change when lithium is re-selected. If you back out of the menu then go back in does it stay changed? 2 hours for absorption is the average time we program in for a bulk/absorb charge. I would only change it down if you find it is in absorb to long or add time if it is not in absorb long enough.

The high voltage disconnect is there in case of spikes from the battery to prevent damage to the unit. With the battery you have you can leave it at 16V.

Are the following GoPower charger (GP-RVC-MPPT-30)*values appropriate for interfacing with the FLX system Lithionics 12V 320AH E2107 GTX UL Battery OEM Model with internal BMS?
High Voltage Disconnect*16 V (GP default)
Bulk-Absorption voltage*14.6 V* *-* I would recommend 14.4 as that is what Lithionics recommends
Under Voltage Warning*12 V (GP default)
Discharge Limit Voltage*11 V (GP default)
Over-discharge Delay Time*10 S (GP default)
Over-discharge return (V)*12.8 V (GP default)
Float Voltage*13.6 V* *-* *Good*
Recharging Voltage*13.8 V* *-* *I would recommend setting this at less than the float voltage. Somewhere around 13.2-13.4V



Let me know if you have any questions.

[SactoSteve]

GoPower charger (GP-RVC-MPPT-30)*values appropriate for interfacing with the FLX system Lithionics 12V 320AH E2107 GTX UL Battery OEM Model with internal BMS

Attached is a summary of my notes regarding configuration of the GoPower! solar charger for use with the Micro Minnie FLX implementation. Also includes a summary of how the GoPower! solar charger functions to charge the Lithionics battery.

I think I am where I thought we should be when we left the dealership.

[JoeMan]

Impressive research. Since you are the experts, what say you, would it be possible to add a second 320amp hour battery? What other components would need to be changed if any?

Thanks for indulging my question even though I know this is a parameters thread. Seems like all of you on here understand the components really well.

[JoeMan]

Woah, I just learned from a thread that the Xantrex fan has to be on when using shore power. That fan is right underneath the bed! How loud is it? It's one thing to have an A/C fan going 12 feet from your head vs a fan going and vibrating right underneath your bed less than a foot away.

Is this a problem or annoyance for anyone?

[naturopath]

Originally Posted by JoeMan

Woah, I just learned from a thread that the Xantrex fan has to be on when using shore power. That fan is right underneath the bed! How loud is it? It's one thing to have an A/C fan going 12 feet from your head vs a fan going and vibrating right underneath your bed less than a foot away.

Is this a problem or annoyance for anyone?

Yes, it is loud and because that compartment has no ventilation it is always on! Leave the compartment closed for a few days and you smell all kinds of things that are not good! Who knows how long these components will even last with all the heat. Very bad design!

[RovingMedics]

honestly, we slept right through it and haven't noticed it. I am a little concerned about the ventilation issue too, though, but it hasn't been getting super hot down there. The Xantrex documentation says the operating range is between "-4 to 140ºF (-20 to 60ºC), with output derated above 104 °F (40 °C)"

I haven't put a thermometer down in the storage compartment, but that's not a bad idea. i am curious how hot it's getting down there.