Surround Sound - Page 2

jhanan · 07-29-2007, 07:20 AM

Yes 1996 - that part is obviouse. The tv/radio switch works fine. So does the power switch on the dash. I found out - as others have noted - that the surround is wired on the same power circuit as the radio, but the radio does not control the volume on the surround when the other switch is in TV position.

jhanan · 07-29-2007, 07:37 AM

I've investigated (messed with) the system more, and without trying to remove the TV and VCR/DVD combo, this is what I think I have found out: The tv/radio input selector works fine. The dash power swith works fine. The Sharp 25" TV may or may not have variable volume out on the sound output. It appears that a previous owner disconnected the TV sound out from the rear of the TV to the surround sound. (but why?) Instead, they wired the vcr/dvd combo directly to the surround sound. (watch TV on back TV and listen to the audio on the surround in the front of the coach - you guess?) The vcr/dvd combo has a fixed volume out. The vcr/dvd does have a "equalizer" control, but it only adjusts frequency ranges and not overall volumne - the vcr/dvd does NOT have volume control. So the volume output on the surround sound fixed off the vcr/dvd is fixed best I can tell. (note I figured this out kinda of by random as I tested a movie in the dvd player and happened to turn the TV off - and the surround sound stayed on, again with fixed vol fixed.) So now that I know this, I have to decide what to do to fix it - either try to plug it back into the TV (requires removing the TV) or put in an in-line stereo vol control pot like others have suggested (a poor resolution). Vol on a the sourround should be controlled but the source being used (the radio or the tv remote).

FrankO · 07-29-2007, 07:45 AM

Just got back from the storage yard trying to fix my Solar problem -- to no avail btw. But I did fiddle with the TV/Surround configuration and I can tell you how mine works -- original equipment. With the TV on, the Booster/Control Box turned on and set to Antenna and the Surround Sound unit on and set so you can use the internal tuner (VCR). In this configuration the TV I am using the internal TV tuner (say Chan 7) and the Surround tuner (also Chan 07). The TV auto mutes itself when it senses the Surround System is turned on so the Surround is playing the same sound that would be coming from the TV but the Volume is controlled by the Surround System. If I turn the Surround off, the TV speakers come to life and are controlled by the TV Vol button.
I am sure there are other configurations that can be used but that is all I experimented with today.
Not sure if this helps as I think you are looking at using a Sat or Cable for input but I have no way of trying that configuration as I do not have Satellite service yet.
If you post your Surround System brand and model number, I might be able to find it on the web and give a little more advice. This is kind of a hobby for me.
Frank O.

tomsm · 07-29-2007, 08:40 AM

Frank and others with 05, 06 or 07 models - while you are providing good reference material for others with the same age coach, it really doesn't relate to the original poster's question. Up through the 04 models and possibly early 05, Winnie used a separate stand alone faux surround sound amp. The variable output of the radio and variable output of the tv was simply switched to provide source for this amp.

The amp has no controls and it's powered off the radio power circuit, thus the need to have radio power set to "coach or aux" when the ignition is off.

The DVD/VCR in these older setups has nothing to do with the surround sound, it's just another input for the tv.

Not that the input on newer coaches is not valuable - just don't want to lead the original poster down the garden path with all the DVD discussion.

jhanan · 07-29-2007, 08:42 AM

Hi Franko. I have the "fake" QSurround system like many other in this year range. I say "fake" as it is not 5.1 system even know it has 5 speakers. And, it may even be mono - I noticed when I did find the connection of the surround to the vcr/dvd (and I found the "hum isolator") that when either L or R sound is unplugged the eact same sound comes out on both sides (e.g. is L is unplugged you get sound from L & R on the surround, and same with R unplugged). My 2002 setup is older than yours. There is no auto-mute. There is no tuner on the surround - it is audio only. Now that you mension Satellite, it does appear that the previous owner had a sat box receiver installed and has removed them. However, it doesn't again make too much sense to me to direct connect the surround to a sat box as that would prevent input from the vcr/dvd. My 1st try will be to see if I can get the surround plugged back into the front TV output - if access allows.

FrankO · 07-29-2007, 08:51 AM

OK, it seems that the OP thread had a different issue then what I was responding to, so jhanan, maybe you should start a new thread which is more pertinent to your setup and question.
Frank

jhanan · 07-29-2007, 09:28 AM

FrankO - I hate starting new threads when we already have this topic - the original post was of my time vintage coach - 2001 surround system and a similar TV only related issue. So instead of creating a new thread, I will stick to posting here or the other "Surround Sound Volume Control" thread which is on topic till I get the problem resolved - either through rewiring or external fix. Thanks.

Tom N · 07-29-2007, 12:39 PM

You can control the output level from your TV if you change the sound in the setup menu from fixed to variable. If you still can not control the sound level your amp is plugged into the wrong sound outputs on the rear of your TV.

-Tom

Norm3206 · 07-29-2007, 02:03 PM

Thanks alot to all that have replied to my original post. I don't want anyone to think I am not reading your responses. My rig is currently in the body shop getting some passenger side decals replaced so I can't try all your good ideas. I am supposed to get it back on Friday and will let you know how things work out with the surround sound suggestions.

Tom N · 07-29-2007, 02:13 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by tomsm:
Frank and others with 05, 06 or 07 models - while you are providing good reference material for others with the same age coach, it really doesn't relate to the original poster's question. Up through the 04 models and possibly early 05, Winnie used a separate stand alone faux surround sound amp. The variable output of the radio and variable output of the tv was simply switched to provide source for this amp.

The amp has no controls and it's powered off the radio power circuit, thus the need to have radio power set to "coach or aux" when the ignition is off.

The DVD/VCR in these older setups has nothing to do with the surround sound, it's just another input for the tv.

Not that the input on newer coaches is not valuable - just don't want to lead the original poster down the garden path with all the DVD discussion. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

This is true. Winnebago dumped the little pseudo 5.1 amp in 2006 and replaced it with a Sony home type 5.1 amp. But, Norm has a 2001 Itasca Suncruiser 35U.

-Tom

David K · 07-29-2007, 05:08 PM

Tom

The problem is that with some of the new LCD flat screens, the audio output menu setup in the TV does not provide for a variable output on the audio. It is all or nothing. That is why I had to go with the little black box that I did.

Norm3206 · 08-05-2007, 07:17 PM

I finally got the Suncruiser back from the body shop and had an opportunity to try everyone's suggestions (plus a bunch more from the wife). Still no surround sound from the TV. I do have the original TV and was able to try every audio option on the menu along with the obvious radio power to house and the radio/tv switch set to tv. No go. Don't know what to try next. I don't want to belabour this but any more suggestions would be appreciated.

Izzyblueye · 08-06-2007, 05:23 AM

A couple of things you might want to check if you have not already done so. One is some 2000-2001 models had a master volume control, mine does not. Even though the book says it does have one. It is supposed to be in one of the cabinets. Further, I can disable my surround sound by depressing the little trigger at the speaker and pulling one wire out. I am talking where the wires enter the speakers. All of this is unlikely but you have tried about every thing else. Good luck

tomsm · 08-06-2007, 05:46 AM

Since the radio sound works, we know everything downstream from the selector switch is OK. I understand from reading the forum that the selector switch actually flips a relay that's down in the dash area. You can find it by flipping the switch back and forth and listening for the relay click.

Check the cable from the TV to the relay at both ends - may have to remove the "cowling" from the bottom/back of the TV. Mine has an opening in the back of the cowling just big enough to get your hand in and feel the cables. If you have the manual for the TV, you should be able to identify what you're feeling by looking at their illustration of the back.

It seems like a long shot that both channels would accidentally be unplugged, but as Homer said, you've tried everything else. If the cable is good on both ends, that only leaves the TV. Good luck...

jhanan · 08-06-2007, 07:07 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Norm3206:
Don't know what to try next. I don't want to belabour this but any more suggestions would be appreciated. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Norm, your problem is somewhat similar to mine (2002 Itasca) and as other have said we have same vintage surround sound. I think your problem is still a sourcing problem like said earlier. The surround works from the radio, so you know the surround system has power and that the selector switch also works because you can switch it on to the radio setting and hear it from the radio but when you go to TV you get no sound (unless it is stuck on radio and will not switch). You get sound from your TV, but not out to the surround. I recommend the following. Dig in the back of the cabinet and find the input to the surround system for TV. I found it because mine was wired with a transform isolator between the DVD player and the source input for TV to the surround system. Once you have found this input (it should be a RCA type input), plug it into another source to test it – like a portable CD player or similar with output volume control. If you get nothing, then it could be that the selector switch has malfunctioned and it is stuck on the radio position. If you do get sound, then you know that the surround still has power and the selector switch is working, but you are not getting an output sound signal from the TV – if you are sure it actually connected to the TV then the problem is with the TV (I'm only getting a fixed output from the DVD as the TV is not hooked up to surround in the first place). I have not found a master volume control for the surround, but I would expect to find one somewhere as seems to me the amp power level of the surround is fixed, only the input gain is adjustable, I believe. Without totally removing all the surround components to see what is wired to what, this would be the next steps I would take.

jhanan · 10-18-2007, 08:32 PM

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">vintage surround sound </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Has anyone replaced the original vintage surround sound with a real 5.1 system using the same wiring and mountings in the rig, and also the same cut out for the sub woofer by the fridge? I'd like to know what you went with on the replacement. Thx.

Windsurferlady · 12-30-2007, 09:53 AM

Hi Norm. I just went out to my RV to check mine. I have a toggle switch in top right hand compartment beside the TV that is the speaker source selctor. If I switch it to TV it won't work until I actually turn my radio on and have the toggle on the dash selected for Radio - House. If the radio is not turned on it won't work. My unit is a 35U Winnebago Adventurer so it might be the same set-up. Hope you get your probmem resloved.
Windsurferlady
Kingston, Ontario

Norm3206 · 12-30-2007, 06:40 PM

Thanks for the idea Windsurferlady! I don't think I actually tried to turn the radio on with the selector switch set to TV. I think I just assumed the radio would play out the speakers. Unfortunately here in Saskatchewan it's a bit cold to check (besides my rig is in a nice storage building 160 kms away). I will certainly try your idea 1st thing in spring. 4 days from early retirement so am looking forward to spending a warmer winter next year!

bsellers · 12-31-2007, 08:32 AM

For what it's worth, my surround sound system won't work with the TV. It will only work through the DVD player, meaning only when you watch a DVD do you have surround sound. My system also works with the radio. They told me during my PDI the surround sound system would not work while watching "normal" TV.

lthrnk · 12-31-2007, 08:56 AM

I'm with bsellers. That is the way I understand it too.