2009 View relay issue in driver seat panel

[WinnView24]

Hi, friends -
So frustrated not finding the info I’m seeking Anywhere on the internet… I’m sure a Pro here can help…
In the drivers seat base, facing the door is a hatch with fuses and three relays inside. The relay in position 7 of the 10-position relay board clicks erratically when the engine is running. After shutting down, with all batteries connected (house and chassis), I removed the common 12v/20 relay which I could feel clicking when the engine was running. I’m confident #7 is the culprit.
With the engine restarted, no clicking happened and I began turning on everything I could to identify what this relay did - vehicle lights, signals, radio, flasher, and house lights, reefer, outlets (didn’t try 12v ones)… Everything I tried worked. Frustrated, I carefully disassembled the relay cube and tested the electromagnetic with 12v and it worked perfectly.
Sooo, either the power source going to this relay is intermittently connecting or ???
Can anyone identify the purpose of this relay and suggest how to further troubleshoot the problem. Nothing major has been done to the m/h that might have caused this sudden relay issue that I can report.

[Morich]

Doing some looking at what info we do get and being aware of what we DON'T get, I think this area will be in the chassis portion. That means we get a fair amount of info for the portion Winnebago adds to the stripped chassis they get from the builder but very little about what was on that chassis when they buy it! Searching the drawings, I do not spot those relays, nor breakers!
Bottom line is that we have little info on that relay if it is what I suspect!

Any chance of a chassis manual in the info packet that might have breaker/relay info?

But a couple ideas to consider may help?
One depends on how hard/easy it is to get to the back of the relay mount. If it is Winnebago wiring and you can get to the wires, there should be a code stamped on the wires.


We can use this list to "decode" the ID for where it comes from and goes to.

https://www.winnebago.com/Files/File...ical_guide.pdf

Kind of a long shot if all else fails us??

Maybe a search for Sprinter specific info would be better? Library or auto parts store for books?

I did find several relays that are involved with the trailer lighting so both chassis and coach involved here but I think these will be under the passenger seat and not what you need.
IF they were the right ones, I can see missing that the break lights are not working might be easy, though???? No info on exactly where these are located but possible under passenger.

Click to get a better view of drawing.



Sorry! Not finding the good stuff on the question!

[WinnView24]

Thanks Richard for replying. Been working on this for days and before posting my query, I spoke to both Winnebago and Mercedes CS and each pointed me to the other for an answer… apparently neither wishes to claim this box…��
But your suggestion re: the wiring codes is Great and maybe the best way to follow the connection path. It is Crazy but not one pix of this panel of fuses, configured in this manner, shows up on the multiple internet sites for Sprinter, MB or Winnebago. I’m quite sure nothing after-market was added by the previous owner too.
I’ll keep digging and will post my Answer here when I find it. thx again.

[Morich]

Idea that you may have tried?
If the relay are all the same, does it seem right to swap a couple to test if it is just a poor relay that is not holding well? Never know what it does but if changing gets it working just go for new? Might be lucky and that works better than good some days!!

[WinnView24]

Thanks, Morich… it occurred to me and will prob buy some new relays just to have around.
Additionally, I found this image in the MB owners manual earlier, showing my fuse/relay panel…However, the relay strip is unpopulated in the image and no description of any relays in the fuse description pages that followed.
Anyway, it confirmed that the fuse/relay panel IS MB Factory BUT my relays must be Winnebago add-ons. I will Follow The Wires and see if the codes on them reveal the source of the power and use of the relay. That was an Excellent tip!

[Morich]

That tip may be good or not at all! The idea I have is that the Winnebago wiring will have the labels but not the MB! Never been there!
So it's a shot that may miss or be great! Never know till we get there?

[WinnView24]

Thanks again, Richard - good news and ehhh news…
Just returned from Storage unit after performing tests
Without the relay installed:
- vehicle started, one brake light would not brighten (more later)
- all other dash accessories worked, locks, heat blower, etc.
-did NOT check the b/u camera… dang…
With the relay installed:
- started, NO relay clicks!!!
- all acc. worked as above.
So… hooray but still huh?
The brake lamp was removed, examined, reinstalled and functioned as normal… a bad connection apparently.
Still no relay clicks so… maybe just a temporary glitch that will stay away. Fingers crossed.
I did not remove the seat yet to document the connections to the relay. Rule #1: if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it
When I get the energy to pull the seat or get bored, i will trace those relays so the Next View Owner that comes here may at least learn from my efforts.
Thx, Safe Travels!

[bigb]

R-7 is your "load relief relay" which turns off all non-essential loads while cranking the engine.

[Morich]

Originally Posted by bigb

R-7 is your "load relief relay" which turns off all non-essential loads while cranking the engine.

You've got to be kidding me!

But then I reread what you say and thought about it and I'm guessing you are not kidding!
Sounds like reliable but where did you get that info?

Doing a bit of search with the info you've given us, I found some interesting stuff that I DON"T want to know----if I can avoid it!

Seems we are fading way into driving computers and they never give me much but grief!!

https://sprinter-source.com/forums/i...threads/64071/

[bigb]

Originally Posted by Morich

You've got to be kidding me!

But then I reread what you say and thought about it and I'm guessing you are not kidding!
Sounds like reliable but where did you get that info?

Doing a bit of search with the info you've given us, I found some interesting stuff that I DON"T want to know----if I can avoid it!

Seems we are fading way into driving computers and they never give me much but grief!!

https://sprinter-source.com/forums/i...threads/64071/

You would be amazed at some of technology Mercedes and others use, for instance many cars increase the AC output on the sunny side of the vehicle, and the new Sprinters have a computerized braking system that recognizes when the windshield wipers are on and applies a slight wiping pressure to keep water off the brake rotors. I'm sure many manufacturers use the same technologies.
I own a Sprinter but finding the relay was just Google Fu, Googled "Sprinter 906 fuse & relay diagram" followed by "Sprinter 906 load relief relay". Apparently I have one too. The Sprinters have 2 chassis fuse boxes, one in the driver seat and one on the inside of the firewall next to the OBD port.

[WinnView24]

Men (btw Thank You for your Service if you are Vets as I am):
That relay panel bigb is referencing does not appear to be the one I have posted a pic of earlier. Also, I’ve googled MB load relief relays in many ways and nothing appears like the general multipurpose relay I removed (and replaced). Photo below.
The “under the seat panel” may very well have a four-blade load relief relay… i dunno cuz i didnt pull the seat yet. This chattering relay is dubbed “multi-purpose”, has five blades, 12v/20A. Used in many places. More like a horn or wiper relay but not those things, i think. The Mystery Continues but thx for the Interest.

[bigb]

My apologies, apparently the load relief relay is in the main fuse box, not the seat base fuse/relay box. I looked it up in my Sprinter WIS program and it appears that the relay spaces in the seat pedestal are provided for body manufacturers for things like lift gates, special lighting, rear heat, emergency vehicle items etc. so in all probability your relay is something that Winnebago added to the build. Funny thing is I scrolled through all of the diagrams (there were 6 or 8) and not a single one had a relay position in number 7. It's possible that yours is different though as I was looking at the program using my VIN which is a 2010 cutaway chassis, the WIS program is all VIN based.

[WinnView24]

I cant tell you how many fuse panel images from Sprinters, Dodge Ram 3500s, Winnebago Views i’ve looked at across the internet without finding ANY reference to the 3 relays installed in the side driver's seat panel in my standard, no-frills View…
The best reference i found is the image above of the fuse panel with 10 unpopulated relay sockets… no help though.
Winnebago service folks just shrug… Mercedes Service folks point at Winnebago… Dealers (Lichtsinn specifically) knew Nothing.
Can such a basic modification be so undocumented?
I guess it is up to me/us to uncover this Secret Of the RV Unknown… Lord knows how many others have had a similar Gremlin under their seats, literally.
Thank you both for ideas. You confirm my investigations. I do wish an old-time Winnebago Tech was here on this forum…

[WinnView24]

I cant tell you how many fuse panel images from Sprinters, Dodge Ram 3500s, Winnebago Views i’ve looked at across the internet without finding ANY reference to the 3 relays installed in the side driver's seat panel in my standard, no-frills View…
The best reference i found is the image above of the fuse panel with 10 unpopulated relay sockets… no help though.
Winnebago service folks just shrug… Mercedes Service folks point at Winnebago… Dealers (Lichtsinn specifically) knew Nothing.
Can such a basic modification be so undocumented?
I guess it is up to me/us to uncover this Secret Of the RV Unknown… Lord knows how many others have had a similar Gremlin under their seats, literally.
Thank you both for ideas. You confirm my investigations. I do wish an old-time Winnebago Tech was here on this forum…

[Morich]

The problem would seem to me to be how the chassis is wired if we look at the info we have found so far.
That would seem to put it into the chassis folks ball park?
But the problem with having an old style Winnebago repair person is that this is totally new style for when they started using the Sprinter chassis as far as I know.
Old style had no relays on unloading the battery for starting, etc.

But a relay is not a really complex thing if we can sort out either what it does or how it is wired into the whole thing.
Agree with not wanting to try to fix as we also say you can't fix it if it's not broken!
Got lots of stories that we could tell about that intermitant stuff!
How about a microwave site failing for 2-4 hours every morning but working by the time we got there?
Turkey vultures bedding down in the transmitter horn! New cover to keep them out fixed it!

Any info like this on the relay?

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/707065210223015178/

[bigb]

Here's a bit more on the body builder or upfitter electrical accommodations in the seat base https://www.mbvans.com/content/dam/m...connectors.pdf

[bigb]

Have you tried removing the relay strip to take a look at it from the backside? It looks like there is a tab on the right side to release it.

[WinnView24]

Here’s a pic of the relay. It’s sold just about everywhere, from $17/ea to 5 for $9.99. Described as “multifunctional” or multipurpose… and used in that manner throughout the vehicle (and many others too).

[WinnView24]

And one from the 5-pin end:

[bigb]

Just a common ice cube style relay?. Not sure if the Mercedes branded ones are any different than the generic ones. Spare relays are something I never carried in any vehicle since they use mostly the same one for many applications so it's easy enough to just swap around
Looking at your second pic though the blade layout is different